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So What, Exactly, Is The Endgame?

Gumbi and Bryan rub their temples in unison on this edition of The Cult Of Colt

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NFL: Washington Football Team-Training Camp Geoff Burke-USA TODAY Sports

You’ve heard the news and are likely still processing, but sometimes it helps to have a buddy to process things with. On this edition of the Cult of Colt we talk about the only thing on everyone’s mind this week: the fact that there are no good fantasy football running backs to speak of on the waiver wires. I mean what is that??

No, but actually, this week we devoted our full attention to the mystifying decision at hand to bench the previously ordained Quarterback Of The Future in Dwayne Haskins Jr. in favor of backup Kyle Allen. Any way that you look at it, the rationale lacks clarity, and believe me when I say that we look at it from all angles this evening.

As the saying goes, this team makes us drink. Gumbi came prepared with the Hershey’s Chocolate Porter from Yeungling, I joined him with another PA-inspired beverage, the Philly Special from Iron Hill. You gotta do what you gotta do when it comes to The Washington Football team.

In what has been dubbed in as many words a rebuilding year (or we can use their terminology up until yesterday of an “evaluation” year) things have kind of made sense: the coaches have assembled a series of young players who make up for an otherwise lack of earth-shattering talent with a desire to prove themselves for the years to come. They allow those players to show their mettle, they sink — or they swim, and one way or another there is a pool of evidence and tape to evaluate and make decisions based off of for the years to come.

Then came yesterday’s decision to bench perhaps the singular player whose lack of experience requires the most evaluating, thereby taking what was a straightforward, albeit somewhat ugly, process, and removing the rudder, leaving the future directionless and the team floating adrift.

There are now more questions than answers, and even fewer paths to finding those answers for the future. Join us as we try to make sense of that which is seemingly senseless this week on The Cult Of Colt.

If you haven’t already, be sure to subscribe to the Hogs Haven Podcast network on Apple Podcasts, Google Play, Stitcher, and Spotify.

Poll

Who do you think should be the starting quarterback for the WFT?

This poll is closed

  • 45%
    Dwayne Haskins
    (1400 votes)
  • 20%
    Kyle Allen
    (635 votes)
  • 33%
    Alex Smith
    (1041 votes)
3076 votes total Vote Now

Click on the button below to reveal podcast transcription.

Bryan Stabbe: Gumbi. I got a lot. I want to, I gotta get off my chest.

Gumbi: What a what a day. What day

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah, honestly, it's been the, the whole week. It has been a real roller coaster. I know there are a lot of people out there who are confused and upset and frustrated and

Bryan Stabbe: Really just like kind of don't know

Bryan Stabbe: How to feel and I'm with them and I honestly i i'm surprised anyone feels strongly about this as I do, of course, we're talking about the fact that you beat me in fantasy football by three points.

Bryan Stabbe: Three points coming back on Monday night the Gumby football team, pulling an upset for the century winning 120 8.8 to 120 5.62 over the Zeke of virus.

Gumbi: It was upset.

Gumbi: With absolute upset.

Bryan Stabbe: Listen, the running back situation is completely untenable we we were both playing New England running backs against each other. First of all,

Bryan Stabbe: No one should ever have to play in New England running back. And this is really what I want to talk about tonight so you can all buckle up for the next 45 minutes because I have a lot of things to say about the New England Patriots running back situation.

Gumbi: You know as much as our fantasy football team and our New England Patriots running backs are important. I, I heard a rumor that became truth today. But did you hear that Duane Duane Haskins. The starting quarterback.

Gumbi: Of your Washington. I know, I know he was drafted pretty high. A couple years ago, but of your Washington football team. He got benched Baba, Baba, Baba, Baba, Baba.

Gumbi: Became third string behind Allen and Smith did you, did you hear about us.

Bryan Stabbe: I think I saw something about that on Twitter. But with all due respect, let's get back to the point

Gumbi: Sorry, sorry.

Bryan Stabbe: Next birkhead I really thought he was gonna at least be able to give me a touchdown this week.

Gumbi: One touchdown for you.

Bryan Stabbe: Hey, thanks for listening. This is the cult of Colt.

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah, Bryan from hogs Haven. You got Gumby, from an undisclosed locations Gaithersburg.

Gumbi: My bunker.

Bryan Stabbe: From the bunker um

Bryan Stabbe: There's a lot to unpack this week.

Bryan Stabbe: I think, let me

Gumbi: Let me, let me cut you off. Let me, let me ask you a question now.

Gumbi: Before we it's going to be a day that this actually matters.

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah.

Gumbi: What you're what you're drinking

Bryan Stabbe: Um, well, I'm sipping on

Bryan Stabbe: A little Iron hill.

Bryan Stabbe: Oh, it's, it's called the Philly special and it is named after the football play the Phillies special I will, in spite of the name. I will fully vouch for an iron Hill has a strong

Bryan Stabbe: Association. There's a really a warm place in my heart. There was actually it's a brew pub. They're like six or seven of them. One of them was on my campus and college

Gumbi: You're talking to. Yeah.

Bryan Stabbe: Well, I've always had a strong affinity for them. I was actually able to while we were in do we pick up a crawler of this filly special. It's a nice IPA.

Bryan Stabbe: So even though I drink it.

Bryan Stabbe: begrudgingly because of the name.

Bryan Stabbe: I will say, very tasty. In spite of that, and the football team. The watching football team did it the Eagles earlier this year so stuck on that.

Gumbi: It is our one victory, um,

Bryan Stabbe: So you may only be our one but that remains to be seen. We'll get more into that. So what what do you sipping on

Gumbi: Well, so I kind of went a Pennsylvania today as well. I actually got my hands on the Yingling her. She's Porter.

Gumbi: Okay, which has been

Gumbi: All over social media.

Gumbi: People have been loving it. I found it now give a quick review of the Hershey Porter. The first sip, you have it tastes more Porter than her. She's okay but as you drink it longer that chocolate taste to stretch to kind of melt in your mouth and become very delicious.

Gumbi: So it becomes a porter. That could be an all day.

Gumbi: All night Porter.

Gumbi: And I like it.

Gumbi: I like it. I would give it you know two thumbs up, drink it up.

Bryan Stabbe: Well, so we're both untapped people. And for those of you who aren't

Bryan Stabbe: I'm not even going to drag you into this. But what what's your, what's your untapped rating on this.

Gumbi: Oh, in the for the 4.25 to get a five on my untapped rating. It's got to be amazing. This is in the four range, which is good tremendously good

Gumbi: I can drink this. I like it. So what about your, your iron Hill. How about that.

Bryan Stabbe: No. Our I think our ratings are slightly different. Mine is this is a for anything above a four is like bordering on exceptional this I think is very, very good. And obviously iron Hill having this place in my heart.

Bryan Stabbe: You know that the bumps it up at least a quarter. So, you know,

Gumbi: Cloud based and

Bryan Stabbe: Yes. Okay. So yes, you're right. Ah, that

Bryan Stabbe: What we are sipping on does have relevance, because there is that I don't know if you've seen it, but there's that shirt that people have, it's, it's in the old

Bryan Stabbe: The Redskins font. So then I use

Bryan Stabbe: When I using that font anymore. I have to distinguish it from Washington football team font, because there are different fonts.

Gumbi: Absolutely. The W looks like something you found off of a bad word document because they really went far into this by just adding a little niche and the W, because that's creative

Bryan Stabbe: But, but, you know what I'm talking about when I say, and there's that it says this team makes me drink.

Gumbi: And does

Bryan Stabbe: Of all days.

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah, this team today has given us a reason to drink and

Gumbi: I want to say that we're both at the same time have our head her hands are our temples and our massaging them and that was not planned.

Bryan Stabbe: It was reflexive, it's

Gumbi: Very flexible.

Bryan Stabbe: To start rubbing your temples, what is going on.

Well,

Gumbi: I don't know the answer to this question. I'm going to dive a little bit in but I want to say that

Gumbi: You and I've talked to a little bit today and your, your thoughts are very direct and awesome. So I want to really let you lose your, your, your damn mind on this a little bit up let me take a first step, yeah.

Gumbi: Please. Hey, and before we get into the the Haskins part. Yeah, I'm gonna dip a little bit into the you know Alex Smith Park.

Gumbi: Your one play away from having Alex Smith as our actual quarterback $75 million and one hit. Later, he can become dust.

Gumbi: Because Allen is our starting quarterback and Haskins is the third string. Yeah. Right now we are dealing with starting quarterbacks we're dealing with serviceable quarterbacks who can do just enough to make the game palatable. Yeah, we're not dealing with a winning culture right now.

Gumbi: But what's your opinion. I want to hear your thoughts on this because because again you have really put it into perspective in the last couple of hours.

Bryan Stabbe: When you and you say, we, we talked about this earlier today. And so far as like I sent you a gift of the anger guy from inside out, with his head exploding and then you send a gift of a splinter going. Alrighty then. And then I send a gift, back of

Bryan Stabbe: Captain Picard face palming and really went back went back and forth like that for five or six hours.

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah, I am. I am baffled by this because it seems it really doesn't make any sense to me. It, it makes so little sense any way you look at it that I

Bryan Stabbe: I feel, first of all, I feel like a sucker for the fact that I've spent as much time today, thinking about a way that it might make sense.

Bryan Stabbe: As I have. It's like it's not worth my time. I know that. But here we are we're talking about. And this is maybe the catharsis to get it off my chest. But insofar as

Bryan Stabbe: You look at Dwayne Haskins this season. Yeah. Well, let's start with this season. He's had four games as

Bryan Stabbe: He was named the starting quarterback in camp with no preseason

Gumbi: Right, not his fault preseason

Gumbi: coven took his priests in a way it has, it did every other person in this league. The League has started off slows

Bryan Stabbe: It has and, you know, just to say that he's even been

Bryan Stabbe: He hasn't been good. It's sort of like, okay, where what's put our like language skills to use. Has he been serviceable

Bryan Stabbe: At times, at times, he has at times. He's been bad

Gumbi: He had one really bad game.

Gumbi: But the rest has been serviceable

Gumbi: Here but he's been he's hasn't lost the game he lost he lost the Cleveland gate, but the rest of games serviceable continue

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah, so far so well. I mean, listen, we're not like stat heads like we're football numbers in so much as like we watched this team and I mean there's no

Bryan Stabbe: here's a, here's a little peek behind the curtain. No one really knows what the fuck, they're talking about. They're just it's, it's, however, confident, you can portray like

Bryan Stabbe: I don't want to put Adam chef drop last but like he has the cell phone numbers of GM and so like he just says what they tell him to say we can start beef with with national beat reporters at some point later but

Gumbi: Yeah, well you know Schechter right come on man.

Bryan Stabbe: Little been um Haskins this year, one in three he's

Bryan Stabbe: He's a little under 1000 yards four touchdowns.

Bryan Stabbe: Three interceptions is TD to Jayanti number is kind of like where you want it to be.

Gumbi: But all they are such as this one game.

Bryan Stabbe: That's true, yeah.

Gumbi: I mean, let's not forget that it's all one game and then uh he overthrew Maclaurin last week by inches for another touchdown. So he's

Gumbi: serviceable I'm not gonna sit here and say he's our future. I'm not gonna sit here and say, Hey, he's the greatest quarterback the Redskins. Sorry. Washington football team has ever had.

Gumbi: But it's been serviceable

Gumbi: Yeah. But before we start attacking him or the guys behind them any better.

Bryan Stabbe: Now, and that's that's really what it comes down to. And, and this sort of, I think, is a multi headed thing that you need to sort of dissect first of all

Bryan Stabbe: The, the guy is protecting him are either injured or or bad will call it will call like is there not good. So it's not as though he's getting protection is options for the people to give the ball to save for Tara Maclaurin who actually, I think, is like a legit. I think he's legit. He's

Gumbi: He could be. Yeah.

Bryan Stabbe: Um, he's been keyed in on and still has found a way to be successful. I'm, I'm feeling very good about caramel corn. But the running backs are trash the rest of the receivers are not that good. The tight ends are not that good. So

Bryan Stabbe: You're not really equipping him for success there either. So he doesn't have a preseason he doesn't have weapons and we came into this year saying okay

Bryan Stabbe: Then the team to the credit said okay, it's a rebuilt. We're going to rebuild. We're in an evaluation stage they mostly call it an evaluation stage. And that's really the coded language for saying like when a rebuild

Gumbi: And that's okay to rebuild. Absolutely. We have a team that we know who exactly who they are and we have watched them do this all season, understanding that this is not the team. It's going to be the future. But let's start letting these guys learn

Bryan Stabbe: It almost feels like a like a season long preseason like they're they're figuring out who's going to make the roster and the roster being next year's team. They are evaluation mode to me means

Bryan Stabbe: Who do you have that you can build around for the future. And the only way you're going to know what Duane Haskins is if you play him.

Bryan Stabbe: And he has had four I said four games under Ron Rivera, he has some tape from last year where he kind of got thrown to the wolves.

Bryan Stabbe: He hasn't had a 60 a full 16 games as a first round pick guy who was brought in to be a franchise quarterback. And so the idea that

Bryan Stabbe: You pull the ripcord I think I referred to as the parachute earlier today. Before I mean he's not even started 12 games at this point it you're very far away from knowing

Bryan Stabbe: What you have just based on black tape. He played one season in college. I mean, really, to full football seasons ago he was quarterbacking a boss. Okay, so when you think about it from that perspective. There are two possible outcomes for the season really there's evaluating

Bryan Stabbe: What you have from your quarterback either a he's good. And it worked out, which is really what everyone wants no one wants Dwayne Haskins to fail. Everyone wants the guy you took your first round pick on to be successful.

Bryan Stabbe: And be a franchise.

Gumbi: Quarterback some level of success in this absolutely you want him to be able to have the opportunity to succeed.

Gumbi: Right, you have a kid and he's a kid still

Bryan Stabbe: Yes, he's very young.

Gumbi: And they say that a good quarterback needs at least as a whole season, a whole season to learn

Gumbi: And talk about how many examples of Hall of Fame two amazing quarterbacks that were there first season or a season that half

Gumbi: And it was absolute trash.

Bryan Stabbe: Manning three Troy Aikman was one and 15 his rookie year and

Gumbi: They didn't. They weren't given up on

Gumbi: Know, and they had trashed teams random that we're rebuilding we have the exact same thing you let them learn. We spent a first round draft pick

Gumbi: We give this opportunity to Dwayne Haskins we let him have an opportunity to see what he's truly made of, and he hasn't done bad right but now I hear people talking as if. Oh, we have a chance to win the division.

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah, well, that's okay. So that's the flip side, and we'll dive in on that. But the. The other option for Haskins. Is he is bad.

Bryan Stabbe: Maybe he is right. How are you, how can you in good conscience say that you can make that evaluation as a head coach of that guy for just four games and then over the course of what like 11 games in his career.

Gumbi: Maybe total 30 practices, they've had to get with each other.

Bryan Stabbe: If he is bad, which I'm not saying he's not because you know what, I'll be honest, like, I haven't. He hasn't blown me away. I don't think he's blown anyone away.

Bryan Stabbe: If he's bad

Bryan Stabbe: You play him all 16 games and if he's bad. You can say, well, we tried we gave it our effort we can end good

Bryan Stabbe: We know what we have here.

Bryan Stabbe: It's not going to work. We gave it. We really tried what's go get Trevor Lawrence or whoever.

Gumbi: Give me my first, second, or third

Gumbi: draft pick

Bryan Stabbe: But they can even save that now because they let's say let's say Haskins doesn't shoot up again for the rest of year, and he may I don't know.

Bryan Stabbe: But you're going to have people at the end of the year. So, well, maybe Haskins has figured it out. But like, we don't really know because we didn't see him play

Bryan Stabbe: So what are you supposed to do with that. What do you spot. I honestly cannot figure it out. What are you supposed to do with him, have they given up fully. I mean, I know that.

Bryan Stabbe: Ron Rivera had a press conference today. He had a lot of things to say.

Bryan Stabbe: And he sort of was gracious in the right ways he sort of said, you know, like the players are frustrated and fans don't see that. And I just think it might be a better opportunity.

Bryan Stabbe: Right now, and you know, okay, so you brought it up, you put Kyle Allen and and i and i will quote I will quote Ron Rivera. He says, you know, right now we're looking at short term glory.

Bryan Stabbe: So did they just abandon ship on the plan. This is a rebuild the say okay well the NFC East

Bryan Stabbe: Just like socks just totally socks and maybe we have a chance to go like seven and nine and get our teeth kicked in against the 40 niners in the first round of playoffs, like the, the lack of of planning and the lack of the ability to sort of stick to a plan. His head spinning to me.

Gumbi: Let me jump in again. I became a fan of this team in the 70s. I remember first memories, the ETS winning the Super Bowls.

Gumbi: You sit here and you hear him talk. He's looking for short term term glory.

Gumbi: I as a fan. I don't want any damn short term glory. I'm sick of that philosophy. I'm sick of those thoughts. I'm sick of hearing that

Gumbi: What I want to do is I want this team properly rebuilt. I want the right people were the right people were supposed to be Ron Rivera supposed to be that

Gumbi: The real supposed to be that bringing Scott Turner supposed to be that the people who did not think short term.

Gumbi: They thought long term they let's take the name away. Let's restructure all this. Let's take everything we have and change it. Let's read change this change this culture so that we have a real team.

Gumbi: For long term goals. So we have a Super Bowl opportunities and Super Bowl chances. Now he turns around says short term if we win, as you said, the NFC East we turn up. What you may not even do with a bad the team, we are

Bryan Stabbe: Now,

Gumbi: We have this team we lose the first round of playoffs, we get rid of the chances of good

Gumbi: Good chances at actual draft picks and we turn around and when the same damn spot we are this year as next year with three randomly slightly server quarterbacks and a team that doesn't work because he wants a short term goal.

Gumbi: He wants to look around, be like, look, we want a division put up that that shitty banner. Guess what I don't want the banner I want rings.

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah, and so

Bryan Stabbe: It to me feels like they are

Bryan Stabbe: I sort of waffle on the idea of like fan tanking like rooting for your team to sock. Like I I have I have friends who are Philadelphia 70 Sixers like process fans.

Bryan Stabbe: Like the people who are actively rooting for their team to just be like dog shit for a long time and it's so it's very cynical to me, and I understand the idea of a rebuild

Bryan Stabbe: As an evaluation tool.

Bryan Stabbe: It feels as though this is a squad that is better suited to suck but figure out that they suck and figure out which ways that they suck. Then in a best case scenario.

Bryan Stabbe: When a trash division and just get bounced in the first round of playoffs and have like a bad

Bryan Stabbe: Draft position because there are a lot of things that need to go right in order for this to just sort of like take those measurable steps. And you know what, maybe the difference between

Bryan Stabbe: The second pick in the draft of the third pick of the draft and like the 20th is, you know, there's a marginal difference there. It's sort of a question of value. But who, who is really

Bryan Stabbe: Like looking for that like short term term glory. Like what are you, what are you doing it for because renovators not getting fired this year.

Bryan Stabbe: In there's like no way

Gumbi: Pretty much about or what know what he's like yeah

Bryan Stabbe: He's playing with House money he's playing with House money, they could go and 16 and he wouldn't get fired this year.

Gumbi: If you know that let the young players learn. Yeah, put them out there, see what they're made of truly give them an opportunity to play on the NFL level and see because again three games for games in

Gumbi: That would be you know 16 games is a huge difference, let them learn. Let them be who they are. Give them a chance to be the best as they can be. Because our best shot for being good for the long term future is the kids playing ball right now.

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah. And one way or another. You got to know what you have. And there's no way you can know like how do you properly evaluate this team.

Bryan Stabbe: In the absence of the player who is brought in to build around it and let's say he's not the answer. And if if you really had to

Bryan Stabbe: Make me gas, I would say probably isn't. I have not seen anything yet. Just to suggest that he really has he or he is the the lowest rated quarterback in the league. I get it. Man, and Troy Aikman whatever

Bryan Stabbe: But like let that play out and, in the event that this is a Jay Gruden Robert Griffin situation where it's the quarterback that you inherited then

Bryan Stabbe: And this feels really terrible because like he's, he's still he's he's younger than me and way younger than you know.

Bryan Stabbe: Not, not offended. It's okay.

Bryan Stabbe: I'm like, let them sink or swim a little bit

Gumbi: You know, absolutely. And then even why, why are we almost but eight years later, nine years later, going through deja vu.

Gumbi: Why does this team. Keep doing this and it brings you back to the most obvious answer is that Duane Haskins was drafted.

Gumbi: By Dan Snyder right

Gumbi: Dan Snyder said this is my quarterback because my son went to bullis with him.

Gumbi: Yeah, he got a job, Dan. Good job. Danny boy.

Bryan Stabbe: He drafted brand Haskins because he wanted like his son to have a fence.

Gumbi: Exactly. And if I was you know I'm not gonna get the families I sorry I almost did something wrong.

Gumbi: So I will try to be good but you know it and you look at this and go

Gumbi: Rivera goes, Okay, this is my team now Scott Turner. Here's our system, we all know that the Carolina Panthers system that was put together that kind of Scott Turner has if Dwayne Haskins is not the quarterback available for that and you wanted to win this year.

Gumbi: Let's talk about something that many people are going to talk about who's available right before the season started that knows the Carolina Panthers offense better than anyone else. Yeah. And what do you got it for cheap. Yeah.

Gumbi: Cam. We could have had cam

Bryan Stabbe: They sure sure they could have

Gumbi: Absolutely, there was

Bryan Stabbe: Out there.

Bryan Stabbe: There were plenty

Gumbi: But you could add Cam Newton who knows the whole thing gnosis got turned off. And if you're looking to win now and teach Haskins that that's where you went.

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah. And the thing is, though, like

Bryan Stabbe: They were very clear in advance of the year that they were not planning on winning this this season and the fact that they have changed their mind after starting one in three but still somehow feeling as though that they could win.

Bryan Stabbe: It, it feels. Honestly, it feels like the early 2000s Washington football team fans mindset on steroids. It's like, oh, we are so close like guys, we are so close to winning a Super Bowl. You have no idea how close we are

Gumbi: Right so far away.

Bryan Stabbe: I'll admit it. You did it.

Gumbi: I did actually

Bryan Stabbe: We all thought this team for not in the last real not really in the last decade, but like in the decade prior to that we all thought that it was it was not that far off.

Gumbi: We were a player to away and Yeah no absolutely

Gumbi: I don't feel that way now.

Bryan Stabbe: This feels like that but way worse.

Bryan Stabbe: Because

Bryan Stabbe: It is so obvious to the naked eye. Anyone who's watching seem that they're like they're just not good, they're not they're not talented, they don't have a serviceable running back. They have one wide receiver, they don't have an offensive line. They don't have any tight ends.

Bryan Stabbe: There they have sunk all their recent draft picks into building a very formidable defensive line, but really nothing to back that up. This is not a team so much as it is.

Bryan Stabbe: A series of parts, some of which are good and some of which are bad, but none of which work in concert with one another.

Gumbi: But you have to take the time to allow those parts to learn and be together. Yeah. And by taking Haskins out in this situation, you aren't allowing that to happen. Kyle Allen.

Gumbi: Has shown over years, the last few years that he's an average quarterback at best was like six and seven. The last he's not a very good quarterback.

Gumbi: Yeah, six and seven reversible six serviceable so he's a quarterback that you just go, Okay, well you know what, no one else's left and his backup now is Alex Smith.

Gumbi: Yes leg was almost entirely ripped off his body and then had to almost have it amputated. And now he's just in the league it back again trying to earn $75 million. We talked about already. Now,

Gumbi: He's our backup.

Gumbi: Literally one good hit and he's done.

Gumbi: But not not just for the day for the rest of his life, playing football and then you just walk away from Haskins where it's like you're not good. How is the Haskins that bad. Do they see I don't see it. I don't see me so bad that he needs me. Third string. He needs behind these people

Gumbi: We've lost our way as a team. We've lost our way as fans and we've lost her way with our owner. This makes it worse.

Bryan Stabbe: It does. Yeah.

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah, I mean, I look at Kyle.

Bryan Stabbe: Kyle Allen ceiling to me is very obvious Kyle Allen ceiling is Kirk Cousins.

Gumbi: I would disagree.

Gumbi: Only buy a little bit. I would say he doesn't quite meet the Kirk Cousins ceiling. I think crystal has a better ceiling and Kirk Cousins doesn't have a high ceiling. He's a game manager.

Gumbi: A very well paid game manager be the game manager. I think Alan is a step down from Kirk Cousins.

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah, he probably is, in reality, like

Yeah.

Bryan Stabbe: I think

Bryan Stabbe: When they drafted Robert Griffin and Kirk Cousins everyone kind of felt that customs is going to be the guy who could manage the game and you wouldn't necessarily want to start, but you might bounce around for a few years. It could be like a Chad henne type if we're doing some guy remembering

Gumbi: Or even like a backup like like Bryan Hoyer

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah, Bryan, a long time but

Gumbi: But it keeps playing every once in a while.

Gumbi: Yeah, okay.

Bryan Stabbe: Or, you know,

Bryan Stabbe: And he ended up. I mean, we don't have to read litigate the kirk cousin era. At this point, he ended up statistically being

Bryan Stabbe: One of the most productive quarterbacks in franchise history, some of that a function of the way the game is played and sort of changes you know it's it's just different. It's a different. It's a different sport.

Bryan Stabbe: And it was when

Bryan Stabbe: Sonny jurgensen was was playing when know any Sammy ball was but it just different. So, Kyle and you know you say six and seven career.

Bryan Stabbe: Having to backup cam really coming in for injury. He was in a situation behind a shit offensive line. He's in he's in a situation that's not too dissimilar from the one he was in while he was in Carolina with Ron Rivera as his head coach. We saw him last year he lost to

Bryan Stabbe: The team that he is playing for right now so you know like 19 to 16 touchdown to interception ratio. It's just like

Bryan Stabbe: There, there is no question. I mean, cow. It's not a franchise quarterback.

Gumbi: No, no. So, so why did we bench Haskins. It doesn't make sense. Kyle Allen, maybe two years, maybe two years and he's gone. Alex Smith, maybe two years he's gone Haskins. We have to hold on to or cut him in for three years and now we have nothing.

Gumbi: So, except except for a chance for a couple of draft picks. But now you want us to win one more game that we're going to win before. So we have short term glory, so we don't get the draft. If you wants or we're, again, we're we're picking 10th or 11th. Great. We've done nothing

Bryan Stabbe: So it's kind of Kyle and what you're saying sort of sounds like. And I know that we're looking at a very limited scope here, but are you saying Kyle Allen is a colt McCoy

Gumbi: Little bit better but yes

Gumbi: Yes. That's exactly what I'm saying.

Gumbi: So he's serviceable yeah

Gumbi: He has flashes of goodness

Gumbi: Yeah. And then the rest is bad.

Bryan Stabbe: The history of the NFL is littered with guys like Kyle Allen.

Bryan Stabbe: To TJ Yates, like I'm you know I'm my brain is just like as much. It's like porridge. I just like remember players like so it's like the fact that, like, okay.

Bryan Stabbe: Well, we put Kyle Allen in as the starting quarterback for short term glory, like those are two. That's a square peg in a round hole. Those two things don't line up with each other at all in my mind.

Gumbi: I think that's a chance. And this is my thought is that direction Haskins and Kyle Allen is one game.

Gumbi: at Carlisle would one more game the Duane Haskins. That's it, we're not talking about, like, you know, all this great glory and we're going to win. Super Bowls. That's not happening. So literally, you're giving up five places on draft.

Gumbi: To put Kyle Allen.

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah, and

Bryan Stabbe: It just the the the whiplash really is what gets to me, it really is. It's exhausting. It's truly exhausting to have to feel this way.

Gumbi: And just

Bryan Stabbe: The lack of justification is painful and you know I was, I was pretty vocal, a year ago saying that under I believed that under no circumstances should Wayne Haskins suit up. I didn't think he should I didn't

Gumbi: I thought you should you should

Bryan Stabbe: You should have. You should have carried a clipboard for 16 games because I truly do believe that quarterbacks who have an opportunity to sit and learn

Bryan Stabbe: For at least one full season do much better than the guys who so like non world beating quarterbacks like there are some guys, you can come in and when immediately when Mark Jackson did a

Bryan Stabbe: Batch homes day you know it happens. It happens sometimes. But

Bryan Stabbe: It is is far more likely that you end up becoming Sam Bradford, if you

Bryan Stabbe: get thrown in to a shit team at a league, that's an entirely different level than the one you're accustomed to. Now listen, I truly believe that Alex Smith is a fantastic quarterback mentor.

Bryan Stabbe: 100% I have just another unity, like two years ago and it's embarrassing to me that I'm not gonna remember his name, though I don't know what's he doing

Bryan Stabbe: What's a kid who is from Hero played backup quarterback for the team, two years ago, I think he ended up getting caught. You went to Denver went to Gonzaga

Gumbi: No clue.

Bryan Stabbe: Come on, Bryan.

Gumbi: If I chase Daniels. I don't remember.

Gumbi: Shows amazing again another quarterback.

Gumbi: who spend their star season you like jumping team to team to team and what a Super Bowl.

Gumbi: And he was used to be. What part of our team.

Bryan Stabbe: Having hope Kevin Hogan

Gumbi: Go. Oh, yes.

Bryan Stabbe: The opportunity with with first moment sports to sit down and have a have we interviewed Kevin Hogan

Bryan Stabbe: In person and he talked about

Bryan Stabbe: Alex Smith, that he had had the opportunity because he was originally brought in by the Kansas City Chiefs for that camp. And then he ended up not making the team.

Bryan Stabbe: And then came to Washington for camp and ended up not making the team, but it was also the year that Alex Smith came over that was

Bryan Stabbe: Alex Smith was a consummate professional. He did everything he could in that camp to talk to and mentor the quarterbacks around him. Alex Smith knew that Kevin Hogan wasn't gonna make make

Bryan Stabbe: Absolutely. But he was a really fantastic person to have sort of around, I believe that Dwayne Haskins would have been far better suited to

Bryan Stabbe: Literally just be Alex Miss shadow for the entirety of his first year and he would have been better off for it. You see it happen. I mean, Aaron Rodgers Aaron Rodgers sat behind brett farr have a lot of people thought to his detriment but ended up not being the case, he was a

Gumbi: Young

Bryan Stabbe: To learn Steve Young

Gumbi: Fantastic exam, Brady.

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah. Yeah, exactly.

Bryan Stabbe: Some guys are just not equipped to go straight from college to being a starter in the league period. And that's not an indictment on them because

Bryan Stabbe: The fact is, if, if you're Dwayne Haskins and you're at Ohio State. And one of the games on your schedule is against Oh, say, the University of male

Bryan Stabbe: who maybe has one or two players on their roster who will be NFL players and it's more likely than not, that those guys will be wide receivers, because for whatever reason they are only these days are only able to turn out wider secrecy.

Gumbi: Marilyn saw use the word we. That's correct. We push out

Gumbi: quarterbacks from the past and wide receivers for the future. That's what Maryland does right now.

Bryan Stabbe: Hey, hey Bay Bay, you know, like

Bryan Stabbe: Hey there was a period of time where there were some pretty solid linebackers coming out of there. You get to come back and he got EJ Henderson. This is my favorite.

Bryan Stabbe: Thought I'd like to talk about Maryland football players from like 2003

Gumbi: Even though we never want anything, man. We got some good players come out of there.

Bryan Stabbe: Oh yeah, they went and got their teeth kicked in by Steve Spurrier and the Orange Bowl that one time. Orange Bowl Peach Bowl. It was the beach ball.

Gumbi: Ball, the Orange Bowl. We actually I think the Tennessee and with the region and did a good job.

Gumbi: All of us let's let's focus right back let's fall

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah I know I can do.

Gumbi: What do Maryland talk later.

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah yeah that's that's our next. Our next

Bryan Stabbe: All that is to say so. Dwayne Haskins an entire game he played in college. I assume he played Maryland because they're in

Gumbi: It. He did.

Bryan Stabbe: So he played he played an entire game against a non NFL caliber defense and that's like maybe will say 7% of the entirety of his college career was spent preparing for a non NFL defense he immediately goes to the NFL, where

Bryan Stabbe: The guys he were he was playing he's playing against now maybe one or two of them. He played against while he was in college like Penn State maybe turns out

Bryan Stabbe: Three or four good defensive players Michigan usually put some guys in the Lake Michigan State okay you can

Bryan Stabbe: You can game plan for one or two really solid defenders, but when every single guy you're playing against it's the, the difference of junior college and the pros is if the College of the pros is not the fifth year of college. It is

Bryan Stabbe: No different thing.

Gumbi: But less than, less than a

Gumbi: Simpson 1%

Gumbi: Of college kids make the NFL.

Bryan Stabbe: Right.

Gumbi: So you're looking at the cream of the crop. So all those players. He went against in the big 10

Gumbi: They and maybe 15 of them maybe 13 or even on a team. Yeah.

Gumbi: Let alone play against him. So you're, you're the cream of the crop everything pops up so you gotta give the guy, an opportunity to learn to adjust

Bryan Stabbe: So there. Yeah, there's no, there's nothing wrong with coming out of college and not being ready to play against NFL players. There's nothing wrong.

Bryan Stabbe: And I know that there are high expectations set by your graph position. He didn't pick where he got drafted. I've heard this before. Actually we I mentioned Doris Heyward Bey, he's actually the example I have in my head. He got picked

Bryan Stabbe: Up by the Oakland Raiders they spent a first round draft pick on him. And I remember that it was one of those situations where they cut to him. This was one of yours. I watched the draft. I don't

Gumbi: Yeah.

Bryan Stabbe: They cut to him and the look on his face is just abject confusion and terror, because I don't think he expected to be picked there it was.

Gumbi: Like zero people expensive to make that high.

Bryan Stabbe: And then, you know, he ended up being an like an okay NFL wide receiver, but like, not, not a great one.

Bryan Stabbe: But people

Gumbi: Still fast.

Bryan Stabbe: People label them a bust. Why, because he got drafted in the first round and wasn't an all pro receiver, it's not his fault that Al Davis was like, like a ghoul like a crypt keeping Google Who da who really likes fast guys don't

Gumbi: Worry. He's got an 83 foot large flame at the ravers ratings rate ravers ruin this. I'm sorry, sorry, sorry, Ranger stadium right now.

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah, well,

Gumbi: At three feet raider stadium.

Gumbi: Out Davis monument sitting there, so he's a goal. Still to this day. Yeah.

Gumbi: It's insane.

Bryan Stabbe: It's haunting Las Vegas, but so it's it's

Gumbi: Not to say that. That's awesome.

Bryan Stabbe: It's not his fault that he was bad or not bad. And there's not as well. That didn't mean expectation

Gumbi: Oh, because he was on. He was on the ship team.

Bryan Stabbe: So similarly Dwayne Haskins was projected out as a, as a first round draft pick, but it's not his fault that he got put into a situation where he just like wasn't really fully equipped to succeed. And right now.

Bryan Stabbe: It seems like they're adding insult to Andrew with him because they are this

Bryan Stabbe: It feels like an additional setback, he should not have played last year. So what do you, what do you benching him for this year. Do you think this makes him better is he better suited now that he's been

Bryan Stabbe: Humiliated. He was voted. He was voted a captain by players on this team like two months ago.

Gumbi: He pushed all when cobra, was it he was trying to pull everything together. He was having camps.

Gumbi: In different places. He was trying to make everyone work together and you've just taken him and you have just disintegrated.

Gumbi: All of the good merit that he has done over all these months with all the wide receivers all the running backs.

Gumbi: And you've now everyone's now tippy toeing around on everything. Everyone, no one knows what's going to happen next. Does that make people. It's a fight or flight situation agreed, sometimes you got to do it, but you do that with somebody

Gumbi: That's a cancer, you know, somebody that doesn't matter. Here's somebody who's trying to be a leader who's working hard, who tried to put it all together for everybody.

Gumbi: And you took that away from him and you broke him down and now he's like a second string if you had put them on second string you would say you need to learn, you need to learn, learn more. Okay, I'm gonna hold the clipboard try no

Gumbi: I put you at third string, you're done with this team now married. That's what was said you are no longer important enough to be on this team.

Gumbi: You are just barely above a scout team. Don't worry about picking up a clipboard. Don't worry about putting on a helmet. Good luck. The rest of the season.

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah and you know there's an A, not too dissimilar example that I think we can look to, and Josh Rosen, who was drafted.

Bryan Stabbe: As a highly touted you know first round guy. I didn't work out for him in Arizona. They cut bait.

Bryan Stabbe: He goes to because he gets replaced by color Murray, the you get sent over to the dolphins ends up being

Bryan Stabbe: benched in favor of Ryan Fitzpatrick, and then they bring in to. And so now he's just sort of like floating around like I don't. He's never going to be a service wonderful quarterback. It's just because he's been totally beat to death and so

Gumbi: Competence level you need

Bryan Stabbe: To

Gumbi: Be a quarterback and you take you taking that away.

Bryan Stabbe: It feels. The other thing with all this, it feels

Bryan Stabbe: Let's say for the sake of argument that this move by Ron Rivera is to try to to motivate him somehow it just sort of feels like a. It's kind of a dubious way to motivate a guy who you know is like really, it sort of seems like doing his best and

Bryan Stabbe: I'll say this. So Ron Rivera seems to me.

Bryan Stabbe: To be

Bryan Stabbe: A reasonable guy in so far as like a professional football coach can be like, they're all lunatics. But if they're already like different brands of lunatics. There's like

Bryan Stabbe: You know, there's like Joe Gibbs who's like sleeping in his office and then there's like Pete Carroll who's like a 911 truth or like they're just like different

Bryan Stabbe: Heights of lunatic.

Bryan Stabbe: Compared to the US to example.

Bryan Stabbe: Seems like

Bryan Stabbe: Like a pretty good guy like

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah, like he wears transition lenses. It's weird, but like he seems OK.

Gumbi: You know, so he's like the cool uncle uncle. Yeah, it makes sense.

Bryan Stabbe: I feel it wasn't my I'll be honest, it wasn't my first choice to be their coach, I'm

Gumbi: It seems like we we recycled another someone else's good coach for the 90th time this team.

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah, and I mean if I had my. If I had my druthers, I would have picked Eric Bimini from from Kansas City. I think he would have been a fantastic. It's, it's kind of appalling to me that he didn't get an opportunity to be a head coach after basically molding.

Bryan Stabbe: Patrick Moore homes and do a Super Bowl winning quarterback.

Bryan Stabbe: It. There are

Gumbi: What we do. I mean, we had all these and again this is we're not, we should have a whole conversation about the coaches, because we had one of the best coaching pedigrees lined up through our system five to seven years ago and we let them all walk out the door.

Bryan Stabbe: On McVeigh, I mean Loeffler up and Green Bay is having like one of the best starts of any any coach in the history of the NFL.

Gumbi: Now Shanahan went to a Super Bowl like

Bryan Stabbe: Like, yep.

Gumbi: We're, we're looking at, like, and that whole pedigrees there and we let it go because of egos because we can't get out of her own damn way.

Gumbi: And this seems like we have once again fallen into that shitty trap of falling into our own recycling or reback going to what we've done every single time. Here we go again and

Bryan Stabbe: It's, it's tough for me to say this because it feels completely defeatist, and I know that I've been a bit of a downer here i'm just i'm saying how I feel this is we're trying to keep it real. Gotta

Gumbi: Do what you gotta do it.

Bryan Stabbe: But part of me in the back of my head is like, okay, let's say they had made Sean McVeigh, the head coach or let's say they had made

Bryan Stabbe: The younger Shanahan a head coach.

Gumbi: The Kyle. Yeah.

Bryan Stabbe: I part of me feels like

Bryan Stabbe: It may not have made the difference. We talked about this a couple weeks ago because with the Browns like the Browns of the Browns like is the Washington football team like

Bryan Stabbe: As long as, as long as insiders here. It kind of feels like they just have like, you know, and in peanuts like and Charlie Brown. There's that kid pig pen.

Bryan Stabbe: And pig pen has like just that dirt cloud that hangs around you. Just like a dirty small child, which is this. There's a lot to unpack there. I remember

Bryan Stabbe: It's, it's sort of feels like is there, like, okay, if cam had been here. We're gonna deal with hypothetical here if Kevin been here, would they be much better. I think probably slightly. Yes.

Gumbi: Absolutely, yes.

Bryan Stabbe: Well, like I don't know. I don't know if they're turning it around and like really figuring it out like is is

Bryan Stabbe: Is it so systemic that they couldn't succeed. Even if you picked a different coach and a different roster of a team that was successful. I don't know the answer to that, if feels that way.

Gumbi: I think you're right. I think that feeling is is is long and this is the hard part. And I'm gonna kind of loop it all back together as long as we have an owner like Dan Snyder.

Gumbi: Yeah, I love it. Like if we love as long as we have Dan Snyder, we are in a situation. We're going to constantly repeat ourselves. Yeah.

Gumbi: The draft pick

Gumbi: I guess was 15th for Dwayne Haskins that we took that day was not a Washington football club or previous never name was, it wasn't a Jay Gruden pick it wasn't a offensive pick it was a Dan Snyder pick

Gumbi: Yeah, as long as we have him in control of this team.

Gumbi: We can expect this disappointment, this being upset and this type of just pure your hatred for what's happening to continue over and over again. We're afraid we're fans because we're fanatics.

Gumbi: Sure. He's an owner

Gumbi: Who's taking that away from us.

Bryan Stabbe: Fandom is not rational. It's not

Gumbi: Not

Bryan Stabbe: There's no we're sitting here, we're trying to have a degree of rationality, but we recognize, like if you're still fan of this team after the last 25 years like there's probably something wrong with you, it's okay.

Gumbi: All wrong with me.

Bryan Stabbe: We're here to

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah, well, you know, it's like okay if let's say Duane Haskins had gone had been had been picked by the giants like some people thought it was going to like, would they be better off. Would he be better off. I don't know.

Bryan Stabbe: I don't know, but it just sort of feels, it feels like we're in a spin cycle. It just feels so like we've been here before. It feels like we're going to be here again and on today of all days were sort of, it's still feels really fresh

Bryan Stabbe: You know, you kind of just got a lingering end of those feelings and scream into the abyss and then have yourself a drink and just just get back after

Gumbi: The I think the we've said it before, and that's where we're kind of looking around and the reality is, is that before this season started before we beat the Eagles in week one.

Gumbi: This team has become exactly who we thought they were

Bryan Stabbe: Sure, yeah.

Gumbi: And and it's disappointing that is you said three I said five wins. And it looks like I'm on the wrong end of that.

Gumbi: Now we have a quarterback change.

Gumbi: We're having a team change.

Gumbi: And I think all of us are in dismay right now.

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah, well, so okay let's let's close out with this, with this question. What do you see as the end game. What's the endgame because the end game before was an evaluation and it was a rebuild it was, what do we have and what are we doing about it who stays who goes

Bryan Stabbe: That has seemingly been turned on its head.

Bryan Stabbe: Because this sort of feels like something that's going to be incredibly hard to come back from

Bryan Stabbe: You know wins and losses aside.

Bryan Stabbe: I think they have made the the first part, the ability to evaluate

Bryan Stabbe: Much more challenging because let's say at the end of the year. You learn what have we learned we learned that maybe Kyle Allen is not an starting NFL quarterback. I think people would have made that same estimation before the season started but

Bryan Stabbe: A great, well, you go into Haskins year two and a half for a year, three at the end of this year.

Bryan Stabbe: What have you learned so far. I just, that's really what comes back to me is like, and

Bryan Stabbe: I'll be honest, I don't really have a good answer for this question because I don't really now know what the end game is

Bryan Stabbe: Based on this, he'll turn that we've seen today.

Gumbi: When you're in the thick of it as an athlete.

Gumbi: Every day, your desire your goals are to win sure there's nothing else. There's nothing else. You are literally blinders on about winning

Gumbi: Ron Rivera is an athlete. He was an athlete for years and years and years.

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah.

Gumbi: He's now looking at this opportunity to win a division.

Gumbi: Which which again, that puts you that put something in your pocket. That's like, hey, I've won something

Gumbi: He's now not thinking about the short term, I mean the long term, he's done with the short term.

Gumbi: Yeah, here's my opportunity. What can I do to make that opportunity happen. What can I do to win.

Gumbi: Here's the problem is that this isn't college. This isn't high school. This is the NFL where sometimes you have to overlook that desire to win short term for long term glory.

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah.

Gumbi: And again, the blinders are on. You see this opportunity, you want to grab that Grail, you want to hold on to and say, look what I did.

Gumbi: But it's seven and nine winning a division. You didn't really deserve it at seven and nine going to a playoffs and getting blown out by another team 42 to 10 you really didn't deserve it.

Gumbi: Take the opportunity learn who your young guys are

Gumbi: coddle them help them make them better so that we have a team 234 years from now. That's so much better than what we're watching now. Yeah.

Gumbi: Sometimes you have to go through a little bit of shit to get to better to be clean. On the other end Shawshank and

Gumbi: That's where we're at, but Ron is lost that for weeks. And when I have a chance to win the division. Yeah. And that makes zero sense

Gumbi: I don't want a division banner up I want Super Bowls. I want opportunities for us to be in circles. I want us to know that we're in the NFC Championship

Gumbi: And again, if we lose. Let us lose by by three points and make it heartfelt because we know we're close. We're not close. That's not the team. We have that's not who we are right now and they are exactly who we said the end think they are. This is not a winning team.

No.

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah, and

Bryan Stabbe: When like when winning was like losing like you're really a loser. And right now, maybe they maybe they do get a game better, but the it's a, you know, not seeing the forest for the trees. It really feels that way. It really feels very short sighted and

Bryan Stabbe: Ah, I think.

Bryan Stabbe: We are programmed to not give this team. The benefit of the doubt.

Bryan Stabbe: I think that's going to take a lot to overcome and this, this doesn't help. It doesn't make me feel more like it doesn't make me feel like the decision making has improved.

Bryan Stabbe: We're not there every day, you know, for better, you know, of course.

Bryan Stabbe: But it doesn't seem like there is any set of circumstances where they can, like, come back from this, let's say doing Haskins those really well in practice, like always been really trying has been figuring out in practice.

Bryan Stabbe: Like, that's not enough like the only way now feels like that Kyle Allen doesn't

Bryan Stabbe: doesn't start for the same for a while his injury.

Bryan Stabbe: You know,

Bryan Stabbe: Just like being worse than Dwayne Haskins has

Bryan Stabbe: Been over the next four games.

Bryan Stabbe: And I will tell you.

Bryan Stabbe: I think we will see Alex Smith at some point under center this year.

Gumbi: Yeah, well,

Um,

Bryan Stabbe: I don't feel great about that we'll, we'll sort of cross that bridge when we get there. It's kind of scary prospects to even consider I just it it really feels. Whereas before, I think this is the most distinct I can put it where I was before the direction we were going

Bryan Stabbe: Didn't feel great. I feel like we're going through choppy waters, it at least felt like there was a direction, but now it feels a little bit more like a rudderless yeah

Gumbi: We had wind at our back. We had no idea. We had a plan. The winds gone the writers gone now we're just sitting there. Yeah. However, as a fan. You know, it makes me so much happier this season.

Bryan Stabbe: What would make you so much happier.

Gumbi: If we had last game at our FK

Bryan Stabbe: Yes. And that is our, which is to say, the Washington football team should play one more game and our FK we've seen the hashtags. We know that some of you are paying attention.

Gumbi: I shut off a

Bryan Stabbe: Lot. One last one more game. Okay. Well, get away when I read it up in the show notes. Okay, I would. Don't put me on the spot.

Bryan Stabbe: Oh boy, I am exhausted.

Gumbi: It's been a long day and it's

Gumbi: Not even over yet.

Bryan Stabbe: A very long day.

Gumbi: Oh,

Bryan Stabbe: I will say, I first of all, I appreciate a everyone has been listening. You've given us great feedback. We hear you. We see you. We appreciate you. I appreciate

Bryan Stabbe: Everyone who's been reading on hogs Haven. We know that you're all lunatics just like us and we love you for it. Just be a little bit nicer to each other in the comments section. The moderating thing is it's it's okay like

Gumbi: It's hard afraid to lose it on us just not on each other.

Bryan Stabbe: We know you know like the commenting new commenting thing like there's nothing you can do about it. I'm sorry, it's, it's not going to go back to the way it was. Stay with us. Okay, hang with us. We're doing our best. The team.

Bryan Stabbe: Is doing something and you're still paying attention. If you haven't stopped paying attention by now. I don't think there's really anything that they could do. Or we could do, or anyone could do to make you stop.

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah, you

Gumbi: You've got your just keep drinking particular yeah let's just

Bryan Stabbe: Just have a drink. Go for a walk. Go read a book. It'll. It'll be okay. All right.

Gumbi: It'll be okay. Yeah. It'll be okay.

Bryan Stabbe: And of course coming, I appreciate you. Thank you for taking this time to to rant and rave with me. There are very few people on this planet who I feel I can really just yell and scream and pull what's left of my hair out and

Bryan Stabbe: And I can see you do the exact same thing. It is funny that we both put our hands on our temples. Oh, that

Gumbi: was hysterical. That was not planned that was ridiculous and Bryan, I appreciate you because you allow all this to happen. And again, sometimes it's good to get a little appreciation. So, sir. I appreciate you.

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah, well, we'll keep this train rolling sometimes trains or train wrecks and you just can't look away. And that's kind of where I'm at right now.

Gumbi: Yeah, let's let's go off the cliff. But here we go.

Bryan Stabbe: Whoa, boy. Alright, so for for Gumby, you've got Bryan from hogs Haven and you have been listening to

Gumbi: The cult of cult.

Bryan Stabbe: Gumbi. I got a lot. I want to, I gotta get off my chest.

Gumbi: What a what a day. What day

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah, honestly, it's been the, the whole week. It has been a real roller coaster. I know there are a lot of people out there who are confused and upset and frustrated and

Bryan Stabbe: Really just like kind of don't know

Bryan Stabbe: How to feel and I'm with them and I honestly i i'm surprised anyone feels strongly about this as I do, of course, we're talking about the fact that you beat me in fantasy football by three points.

Bryan Stabbe: Three points coming back on Monday night the Gumby football team, pulling an upset for the century winning 120 8.8 to 120 5.62 over the Zeke of virus.

Gumbi: It was upset.

Gumbi: With absolute upset.

Bryan Stabbe: Listen, the running back situation is completely untenable we we were both playing New England running backs against each other. First of all,

Bryan Stabbe: No one should ever have to play in New England running back. And this is really what I want to talk about tonight so you can all buckle up for the next 45 minutes because I have a lot of things to say about the New England Patriots running back situation.

Gumbi: You know as much as our fantasy football team and our New England Patriots running backs are important. I, I heard a rumor that became truth today. But did you hear that Duane Duane Haskins. The starting quarterback.

Gumbi: Of your Washington. I know, I know he was drafted pretty high. A couple years ago, but of your Washington football team. He got benched Baba, Baba, Baba, Baba, Baba.

Gumbi: Became third string behind Allen and Smith did you, did you hear about us.

Bryan Stabbe: I think I saw something about that on Twitter. But with all due respect, let's get back to the point

Gumbi: Sorry, sorry.

Bryan Stabbe: Next birkhead I really thought he was gonna at least be able to give me a touchdown this week.

Gumbi: One touchdown for you.

Bryan Stabbe: Hey, thanks for listening. This is the cult of Colt.

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah, Bryan from hogs Haven. You got Gumby, from an undisclosed locations Gaithersburg.

Gumbi: My bunker.

Bryan Stabbe: From the bunker um

Bryan Stabbe: There's a lot to unpack this week.

Bryan Stabbe: I think, let me

Gumbi: Let me, let me cut you off. Let me, let me ask you a question now.

Gumbi: Before we it's going to be a day that this actually matters.

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah.

Gumbi: What you're what you're drinking

Bryan Stabbe: Um, well, I'm sipping on

Bryan Stabbe: A little Iron hill.

Bryan Stabbe: Oh, it's, it's called the Philly special and it is named after the football play the Phillies special I will, in spite of the name. I will fully vouch for an iron Hill has a strong

Bryan Stabbe: Association. There's a really a warm place in my heart. There was actually it's a brew pub. They're like six or seven of them. One of them was on my campus and college

Gumbi: You're talking to. Yeah.

Bryan Stabbe: Well, I've always had a strong affinity for them. I was actually able to while we were in do we pick up a crawler of this filly special. It's a nice IPA.

Bryan Stabbe: So even though I drink it.

Bryan Stabbe: begrudgingly because of the name.

Bryan Stabbe: I will say, very tasty. In spite of that, and the football team. The watching football team did it the Eagles earlier this year so stuck on that.

Gumbi: It is our one victory, um,

Bryan Stabbe: So you may only be our one but that remains to be seen. We'll get more into that. So what what do you sipping on

Gumbi: Well, so I kind of went a Pennsylvania today as well. I actually got my hands on the Yingling her. She's Porter.

Gumbi: Okay, which has been

Gumbi: All over social media.

Gumbi: People have been loving it. I found it now give a quick review of the Hershey Porter. The first sip, you have it tastes more Porter than her. She's okay but as you drink it longer that chocolate taste to stretch to kind of melt in your mouth and become very delicious.

Gumbi: So it becomes a porter. That could be an all day.

Gumbi: All night Porter.

Gumbi: And I like it.

Gumbi: I like it. I would give it you know two thumbs up, drink it up.

Bryan Stabbe: Well, so we're both untapped people. And for those of you who aren't

Bryan Stabbe: I'm not even going to drag you into this. But what what's your, what's your untapped rating on this.

Gumbi: Oh, in the for the 4.25 to get a five on my untapped rating. It's got to be amazing. This is in the four range, which is good tremendously good

Gumbi: I can drink this. I like it. So what about your, your iron Hill. How about that.

Bryan Stabbe: No. Our I think our ratings are slightly different. Mine is this is a for anything above a four is like bordering on exceptional this I think is very, very good. And obviously iron Hill having this place in my heart.

Bryan Stabbe: You know that the bumps it up at least a quarter. So, you know,

Gumbi: Cloud based and

Bryan Stabbe: Yes. Okay. So yes, you're right. Ah, that

Bryan Stabbe: What we are sipping on does have relevance, because there is that I don't know if you've seen it, but there's that shirt that people have, it's, it's in the old

Bryan Stabbe: The Redskins font. So then I use

Bryan Stabbe: When I using that font anymore. I have to distinguish it from Washington football team font, because there are different fonts.

Gumbi: Absolutely. The W looks like something you found off of a bad word document because they really went far into this by just adding a little niche and the W, because that's creative

Bryan Stabbe: But, but, you know what I'm talking about when I say, and there's that it says this team makes me drink.

Gumbi: And does

Bryan Stabbe: Of all days.

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah, this team today has given us a reason to drink and

Gumbi: I want to say that we're both at the same time have our head her hands are our temples and our massaging them and that was not planned.

Bryan Stabbe: It was reflexive, it's

Gumbi: Very flexible.

Bryan Stabbe: To start rubbing your temples, what is going on.

Well,

Gumbi: I don't know the answer to this question. I'm going to dive a little bit in but I want to say that

Gumbi: You and I've talked to a little bit today and your, your thoughts are very direct and awesome. So I want to really let you lose your, your, your damn mind on this a little bit up let me take a first step, yeah.

Gumbi: Please. Hey, and before we get into the the Haskins part. Yeah, I'm gonna dip a little bit into the you know Alex Smith Park.

Gumbi: Your one play away from having Alex Smith as our actual quarterback $75 million and one hit. Later, he can become dust.

Gumbi: Because Allen is our starting quarterback and Haskins is the third string. Yeah. Right now we are dealing with starting quarterbacks we're dealing with serviceable quarterbacks who can do just enough to make the game palatable. Yeah, we're not dealing with a winning culture right now.

Gumbi: But what's your opinion. I want to hear your thoughts on this because because again you have really put it into perspective in the last couple of hours.

Bryan Stabbe: When you and you say, we, we talked about this earlier today. And so far as like I sent you a gift of the anger guy from inside out, with his head exploding and then you send a gift of a splinter going. Alrighty then. And then I send a gift, back of

Bryan Stabbe: Captain Picard face palming and really went back went back and forth like that for five or six hours.

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah, I am. I am baffled by this because it seems it really doesn't make any sense to me. It, it makes so little sense any way you look at it that I

Bryan Stabbe: I feel, first of all, I feel like a sucker for the fact that I've spent as much time today, thinking about a way that it might make sense.

Bryan Stabbe: As I have. It's like it's not worth my time. I know that. But here we are we're talking about. And this is maybe the catharsis to get it off my chest. But insofar as

Bryan Stabbe: You look at Dwayne Haskins this season. Yeah. Well, let's start with this season. He's had four games as

Bryan Stabbe: He was named the starting quarterback in camp with no preseason

Gumbi: Right, not his fault preseason

Gumbi: coven took his priests in a way it has, it did every other person in this league. The League has started off slows

Bryan Stabbe: It has and, you know, just to say that he's even been

Bryan Stabbe: He hasn't been good. It's sort of like, okay, where what's put our like language skills to use. Has he been serviceable

Bryan Stabbe: At times, at times, he has at times. He's been bad

Gumbi: He had one really bad game.

Gumbi: But the rest has been serviceable

Gumbi: Here but he's been he's hasn't lost the game he lost he lost the Cleveland gate, but the rest of games serviceable continue

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah, so far so well. I mean, listen, we're not like stat heads like we're football numbers in so much as like we watched this team and I mean there's no

Bryan Stabbe: here's a, here's a little peek behind the curtain. No one really knows what the fuck, they're talking about. They're just it's, it's, however, confident, you can portray like

Bryan Stabbe: I don't want to put Adam chef drop last but like he has the cell phone numbers of GM and so like he just says what they tell him to say we can start beef with with national beat reporters at some point later but

Gumbi: Yeah, well you know Schechter right come on man.

Bryan Stabbe: Little been um Haskins this year, one in three he's

Bryan Stabbe: He's a little under 1000 yards four touchdowns.

Bryan Stabbe: Three interceptions is TD to Jayanti number is kind of like where you want it to be.

Gumbi: But all they are such as this one game.

Bryan Stabbe: That's true, yeah.

Gumbi: I mean, let's not forget that it's all one game and then uh he overthrew Maclaurin last week by inches for another touchdown. So he's

Gumbi: serviceable I'm not gonna sit here and say he's our future. I'm not gonna sit here and say, Hey, he's the greatest quarterback the Redskins. Sorry. Washington football team has ever had.

Gumbi: But it's been serviceable

Gumbi: Yeah. But before we start attacking him or the guys behind them any better.

Bryan Stabbe: Now, and that's that's really what it comes down to. And, and this sort of, I think, is a multi headed thing that you need to sort of dissect first of all

Bryan Stabbe: The, the guy is protecting him are either injured or or bad will call it will call like is there not good. So it's not as though he's getting protection is options for the people to give the ball to save for Tara Maclaurin who actually, I think, is like a legit. I think he's legit. He's

Gumbi: He could be. Yeah.

Bryan Stabbe: Um, he's been keyed in on and still has found a way to be successful. I'm, I'm feeling very good about caramel corn. But the running backs are trash the rest of the receivers are not that good. The tight ends are not that good. So

Bryan Stabbe: You're not really equipping him for success there either. So he doesn't have a preseason he doesn't have weapons and we came into this year saying okay

Bryan Stabbe: Then the team to the credit said okay, it's a rebuilt. We're going to rebuild. We're in an evaluation stage they mostly call it an evaluation stage. And that's really the coded language for saying like when a rebuild

Gumbi: And that's okay to rebuild. Absolutely. We have a team that we know who exactly who they are and we have watched them do this all season, understanding that this is not the team. It's going to be the future. But let's start letting these guys learn

Bryan Stabbe: It almost feels like a like a season long preseason like they're they're figuring out who's going to make the roster and the roster being next year's team. They are evaluation mode to me means

Bryan Stabbe: Who do you have that you can build around for the future. And the only way you're going to know what Duane Haskins is if you play him.

Bryan Stabbe: And he has had four I said four games under Ron Rivera, he has some tape from last year where he kind of got thrown to the wolves.

Bryan Stabbe: He hasn't had a 60 a full 16 games as a first round pick guy who was brought in to be a franchise quarterback. And so the idea that

Bryan Stabbe: You pull the ripcord I think I referred to as the parachute earlier today. Before I mean he's not even started 12 games at this point it you're very far away from knowing

Bryan Stabbe: What you have just based on black tape. He played one season in college. I mean, really, to full football seasons ago he was quarterbacking a boss. Okay, so when you think about it from that perspective. There are two possible outcomes for the season really there's evaluating

Bryan Stabbe: What you have from your quarterback either a he's good. And it worked out, which is really what everyone wants no one wants Dwayne Haskins to fail. Everyone wants the guy you took your first round pick on to be successful.

Bryan Stabbe: And be a franchise.

Gumbi: Quarterback some level of success in this absolutely you want him to be able to have the opportunity to succeed.

Gumbi: Right, you have a kid and he's a kid still

Bryan Stabbe: Yes, he's very young.

Gumbi: And they say that a good quarterback needs at least as a whole season, a whole season to learn

Gumbi: And talk about how many examples of Hall of Fame two amazing quarterbacks that were there first season or a season that half

Gumbi: And it was absolute trash.

Bryan Stabbe: Manning three Troy Aikman was one and 15 his rookie year and

Gumbi: They didn't. They weren't given up on

Gumbi: Know, and they had trashed teams random that we're rebuilding we have the exact same thing you let them learn. We spent a first round draft pick

Gumbi: We give this opportunity to Dwayne Haskins we let him have an opportunity to see what he's truly made of, and he hasn't done bad right but now I hear people talking as if. Oh, we have a chance to win the division.

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah, well, that's okay. So that's the flip side, and we'll dive in on that. But the. The other option for Haskins. Is he is bad.

Bryan Stabbe: Maybe he is right. How are you, how can you in good conscience say that you can make that evaluation as a head coach of that guy for just four games and then over the course of what like 11 games in his career.

Gumbi: Maybe total 30 practices, they've had to get with each other.

Bryan Stabbe: If he is bad, which I'm not saying he's not because you know what, I'll be honest, like, I haven't. He hasn't blown me away. I don't think he's blown anyone away.

Bryan Stabbe: If he's bad

Bryan Stabbe: You play him all 16 games and if he's bad. You can say, well, we tried we gave it our effort we can end good

Bryan Stabbe: We know what we have here.

Bryan Stabbe: It's not going to work. We gave it. We really tried what's go get Trevor Lawrence or whoever.

Gumbi: Give me my first, second, or third

Gumbi: draft pick

Bryan Stabbe: But they can even save that now because they let's say let's say Haskins doesn't shoot up again for the rest of year, and he may I don't know.

Bryan Stabbe: But you're going to have people at the end of the year. So, well, maybe Haskins has figured it out. But like, we don't really know because we didn't see him play

Bryan Stabbe: So what are you supposed to do with that. What do you spot. I honestly cannot figure it out. What are you supposed to do with him, have they given up fully. I mean, I know that.

Bryan Stabbe: Ron Rivera had a press conference today. He had a lot of things to say.

Bryan Stabbe: And he sort of was gracious in the right ways he sort of said, you know, like the players are frustrated and fans don't see that. And I just think it might be a better opportunity.

Bryan Stabbe: Right now, and you know, okay, so you brought it up, you put Kyle Allen and and i and i will quote I will quote Ron Rivera. He says, you know, right now we're looking at short term glory.

Bryan Stabbe: So did they just abandon ship on the plan. This is a rebuild the say okay well the NFC East

Bryan Stabbe: Just like socks just totally socks and maybe we have a chance to go like seven and nine and get our teeth kicked in against the 40 niners in the first round of playoffs, like the, the lack of of planning and the lack of the ability to sort of stick to a plan. His head spinning to me.

Gumbi: Let me jump in again. I became a fan of this team in the 70s. I remember first memories, the ETS winning the Super Bowls.

Gumbi: You sit here and you hear him talk. He's looking for short term term glory.

Gumbi: I as a fan. I don't want any damn short term glory. I'm sick of that philosophy. I'm sick of those thoughts. I'm sick of hearing that

Gumbi: What I want to do is I want this team properly rebuilt. I want the right people were the right people were supposed to be Ron Rivera supposed to be that

Gumbi: The real supposed to be that bringing Scott Turner supposed to be that the people who did not think short term.

Gumbi: They thought long term they let's take the name away. Let's restructure all this. Let's take everything we have and change it. Let's read change this change this culture so that we have a real team.

Gumbi: For long term goals. So we have a Super Bowl opportunities and Super Bowl chances. Now he turns around says short term if we win, as you said, the NFC East we turn up. What you may not even do with a bad the team, we are

Bryan Stabbe: Now,

Gumbi: We have this team we lose the first round of playoffs, we get rid of the chances of good

Gumbi: Good chances at actual draft picks and we turn around and when the same damn spot we are this year as next year with three randomly slightly server quarterbacks and a team that doesn't work because he wants a short term goal.

Gumbi: He wants to look around, be like, look, we want a division put up that that shitty banner. Guess what I don't want the banner I want rings.

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah, and so

Bryan Stabbe: It to me feels like they are

Bryan Stabbe: I sort of waffle on the idea of like fan tanking like rooting for your team to sock. Like I I have I have friends who are Philadelphia 70 Sixers like process fans.

Bryan Stabbe: Like the people who are actively rooting for their team to just be like dog shit for a long time and it's so it's very cynical to me, and I understand the idea of a rebuild

Bryan Stabbe: As an evaluation tool.

Bryan Stabbe: It feels as though this is a squad that is better suited to suck but figure out that they suck and figure out which ways that they suck. Then in a best case scenario.

Bryan Stabbe: When a trash division and just get bounced in the first round of playoffs and have like a bad

Bryan Stabbe: Draft position because there are a lot of things that need to go right in order for this to just sort of like take those measurable steps. And you know what, maybe the difference between

Bryan Stabbe: The second pick in the draft of the third pick of the draft and like the 20th is, you know, there's a marginal difference there. It's sort of a question of value. But who, who is really

Bryan Stabbe: Like looking for that like short term term glory. Like what are you, what are you doing it for because renovators not getting fired this year.

Bryan Stabbe: In there's like no way

Gumbi: Pretty much about or what know what he's like yeah

Bryan Stabbe: He's playing with House money he's playing with House money, they could go and 16 and he wouldn't get fired this year.

Gumbi: If you know that let the young players learn. Yeah, put them out there, see what they're made of truly give them an opportunity to play on the NFL level and see because again three games for games in

Gumbi: That would be you know 16 games is a huge difference, let them learn. Let them be who they are. Give them a chance to be the best as they can be. Because our best shot for being good for the long term future is the kids playing ball right now.

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah. And one way or another. You got to know what you have. And there's no way you can know like how do you properly evaluate this team.

Bryan Stabbe: In the absence of the player who is brought in to build around it and let's say he's not the answer. And if if you really had to

Bryan Stabbe: Make me gas, I would say probably isn't. I have not seen anything yet. Just to suggest that he really has he or he is the the lowest rated quarterback in the league. I get it. Man, and Troy Aikman whatever

Bryan Stabbe: But like let that play out and, in the event that this is a Jay Gruden Robert Griffin situation where it's the quarterback that you inherited then

Bryan Stabbe: And this feels really terrible because like he's, he's still he's he's younger than me and way younger than you know.

Bryan Stabbe: Not, not offended. It's okay.

Bryan Stabbe: I'm like, let them sink or swim a little bit

Gumbi: You know, absolutely. And then even why, why are we almost but eight years later, nine years later, going through deja vu.

Gumbi: Why does this team. Keep doing this and it brings you back to the most obvious answer is that Duane Haskins was drafted.

Gumbi: By Dan Snyder right

Gumbi: Dan Snyder said this is my quarterback because my son went to bullis with him.

Gumbi: Yeah, he got a job, Dan. Good job. Danny boy.

Bryan Stabbe: He drafted brand Haskins because he wanted like his son to have a fence.

Gumbi: Exactly. And if I was you know I'm not gonna get the families I sorry I almost did something wrong.

Gumbi: So I will try to be good but you know it and you look at this and go

Gumbi: Rivera goes, Okay, this is my team now Scott Turner. Here's our system, we all know that the Carolina Panthers system that was put together that kind of Scott Turner has if Dwayne Haskins is not the quarterback available for that and you wanted to win this year.

Gumbi: Let's talk about something that many people are going to talk about who's available right before the season started that knows the Carolina Panthers offense better than anyone else. Yeah. And what do you got it for cheap. Yeah.

Gumbi: Cam. We could have had cam

Bryan Stabbe: They sure sure they could have

Gumbi: Absolutely, there was

Bryan Stabbe: Out there.

Bryan Stabbe: There were plenty

Gumbi: But you could add Cam Newton who knows the whole thing gnosis got turned off. And if you're looking to win now and teach Haskins that that's where you went.

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah. And the thing is, though, like

Bryan Stabbe: They were very clear in advance of the year that they were not planning on winning this this season and the fact that they have changed their mind after starting one in three but still somehow feeling as though that they could win.

Bryan Stabbe: It, it feels. Honestly, it feels like the early 2000s Washington football team fans mindset on steroids. It's like, oh, we are so close like guys, we are so close to winning a Super Bowl. You have no idea how close we are

Gumbi: Right so far away.

Bryan Stabbe: I'll admit it. You did it.

Gumbi: I did actually

Bryan Stabbe: We all thought this team for not in the last real not really in the last decade, but like in the decade prior to that we all thought that it was it was not that far off.

Gumbi: We were a player to away and Yeah no absolutely

Gumbi: I don't feel that way now.

Bryan Stabbe: This feels like that but way worse.

Bryan Stabbe: Because

Bryan Stabbe: It is so obvious to the naked eye. Anyone who's watching seem that they're like they're just not good, they're not they're not talented, they don't have a serviceable running back. They have one wide receiver, they don't have an offensive line. They don't have any tight ends.

Bryan Stabbe: There they have sunk all their recent draft picks into building a very formidable defensive line, but really nothing to back that up. This is not a team so much as it is.

Bryan Stabbe: A series of parts, some of which are good and some of which are bad, but none of which work in concert with one another.

Gumbi: But you have to take the time to allow those parts to learn and be together. Yeah. And by taking Haskins out in this situation, you aren't allowing that to happen. Kyle Allen.

Gumbi: Has shown over years, the last few years that he's an average quarterback at best was like six and seven. The last he's not a very good quarterback.

Gumbi: Yeah, six and seven reversible six serviceable so he's a quarterback that you just go, Okay, well you know what, no one else's left and his backup now is Alex Smith.

Gumbi: Yes leg was almost entirely ripped off his body and then had to almost have it amputated. And now he's just in the league it back again trying to earn $75 million. We talked about already. Now,

Gumbi: He's our backup.

Gumbi: Literally one good hit and he's done.

Gumbi: But not not just for the day for the rest of his life, playing football and then you just walk away from Haskins where it's like you're not good. How is the Haskins that bad. Do they see I don't see it. I don't see me so bad that he needs me. Third string. He needs behind these people

Gumbi: We've lost our way as a team. We've lost our way as fans and we've lost her way with our owner. This makes it worse.

Bryan Stabbe: It does. Yeah.

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah, I mean, I look at Kyle.

Bryan Stabbe: Kyle Allen ceiling to me is very obvious Kyle Allen ceiling is Kirk Cousins.

Gumbi: I would disagree.

Gumbi: Only buy a little bit. I would say he doesn't quite meet the Kirk Cousins ceiling. I think crystal has a better ceiling and Kirk Cousins doesn't have a high ceiling. He's a game manager.

Gumbi: A very well paid game manager be the game manager. I think Alan is a step down from Kirk Cousins.

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah, he probably is, in reality, like

Yeah.

Bryan Stabbe: I think

Bryan Stabbe: When they drafted Robert Griffin and Kirk Cousins everyone kind of felt that customs is going to be the guy who could manage the game and you wouldn't necessarily want to start, but you might bounce around for a few years. It could be like a Chad henne type if we're doing some guy remembering

Gumbi: Or even like a backup like like Bryan Hoyer

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah, Bryan, a long time but

Gumbi: But it keeps playing every once in a while.

Gumbi: Yeah, okay.

Bryan Stabbe: Or, you know,

Bryan Stabbe: And he ended up. I mean, we don't have to read litigate the kirk cousin era. At this point, he ended up statistically being

Bryan Stabbe: One of the most productive quarterbacks in franchise history, some of that a function of the way the game is played and sort of changes you know it's it's just different. It's a different. It's a different sport.

Bryan Stabbe: And it was when

Bryan Stabbe: Sonny jurgensen was was playing when know any Sammy ball was but it just different. So, Kyle and you know you say six and seven career.

Bryan Stabbe: Having to backup cam really coming in for injury. He was in a situation behind a shit offensive line. He's in he's in a situation that's not too dissimilar from the one he was in while he was in Carolina with Ron Rivera as his head coach. We saw him last year he lost to

Bryan Stabbe: The team that he is playing for right now so you know like 19 to 16 touchdown to interception ratio. It's just like

Bryan Stabbe: There, there is no question. I mean, cow. It's not a franchise quarterback.

Gumbi: No, no. So, so why did we bench Haskins. It doesn't make sense. Kyle Allen, maybe two years, maybe two years and he's gone. Alex Smith, maybe two years he's gone Haskins. We have to hold on to or cut him in for three years and now we have nothing.

Gumbi: So, except except for a chance for a couple of draft picks. But now you want us to win one more game that we're going to win before. So we have short term glory, so we don't get the draft. If you wants or we're, again, we're we're picking 10th or 11th. Great. We've done nothing

Bryan Stabbe: So it's kind of Kyle and what you're saying sort of sounds like. And I know that we're looking at a very limited scope here, but are you saying Kyle Allen is a colt McCoy

Gumbi: Little bit better but yes

Gumbi: Yes. That's exactly what I'm saying.

Gumbi: So he's serviceable yeah

Gumbi: He has flashes of goodness

Gumbi: Yeah. And then the rest is bad.

Bryan Stabbe: The history of the NFL is littered with guys like Kyle Allen.

Bryan Stabbe: To TJ Yates, like I'm you know I'm my brain is just like as much. It's like porridge. I just like remember players like so it's like the fact that, like, okay.

Bryan Stabbe: Well, we put Kyle Allen in as the starting quarterback for short term glory, like those are two. That's a square peg in a round hole. Those two things don't line up with each other at all in my mind.

Gumbi: I think that's a chance. And this is my thought is that direction Haskins and Kyle Allen is one game.

Gumbi: at Carlisle would one more game the Duane Haskins. That's it, we're not talking about, like, you know, all this great glory and we're going to win. Super Bowls. That's not happening. So literally, you're giving up five places on draft.

Gumbi: To put Kyle Allen.

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah, and

Bryan Stabbe: It just the the the whiplash really is what gets to me, it really is. It's exhausting. It's truly exhausting to have to feel this way.

Gumbi: And just

Bryan Stabbe: The lack of justification is painful and you know I was, I was pretty vocal, a year ago saying that under I believed that under no circumstances should Wayne Haskins suit up. I didn't think he should I didn't

Gumbi: I thought you should you should

Bryan Stabbe: You should have. You should have carried a clipboard for 16 games because I truly do believe that quarterbacks who have an opportunity to sit and learn

Bryan Stabbe: For at least one full season do much better than the guys who so like non world beating quarterbacks like there are some guys, you can come in and when immediately when Mark Jackson did a

Bryan Stabbe: Batch homes day you know it happens. It happens sometimes. But

Bryan Stabbe: It is is far more likely that you end up becoming Sam Bradford, if you

Bryan Stabbe: get thrown in to a shit team at a league, that's an entirely different level than the one you're accustomed to. Now listen, I truly believe that Alex Smith is a fantastic quarterback mentor.

Bryan Stabbe: 100% I have just another unity, like two years ago and it's embarrassing to me that I'm not gonna remember his name, though I don't know what's he doing

Bryan Stabbe: What's a kid who is from Hero played backup quarterback for the team, two years ago, I think he ended up getting caught. You went to Denver went to Gonzaga

Gumbi: No clue.

Bryan Stabbe: Come on, Bryan.

Gumbi: If I chase Daniels. I don't remember.

Gumbi: Shows amazing again another quarterback.

Gumbi: who spend their star season you like jumping team to team to team and what a Super Bowl.

Gumbi: And he was used to be. What part of our team.

Bryan Stabbe: Having hope Kevin Hogan

Gumbi: Go. Oh, yes.

Bryan Stabbe: The opportunity with with first moment sports to sit down and have a have we interviewed Kevin Hogan

Bryan Stabbe: In person and he talked about

Bryan Stabbe: Alex Smith, that he had had the opportunity because he was originally brought in by the Kansas City Chiefs for that camp. And then he ended up not making the team.

Bryan Stabbe: And then came to Washington for camp and ended up not making the team, but it was also the year that Alex Smith came over that was

Bryan Stabbe: Alex Smith was a consummate professional. He did everything he could in that camp to talk to and mentor the quarterbacks around him. Alex Smith knew that Kevin Hogan wasn't gonna make make

Bryan Stabbe: Absolutely. But he was a really fantastic person to have sort of around, I believe that Dwayne Haskins would have been far better suited to

Bryan Stabbe: Literally just be Alex Miss shadow for the entirety of his first year and he would have been better off for it. You see it happen. I mean, Aaron Rodgers Aaron Rodgers sat behind brett farr have a lot of people thought to his detriment but ended up not being the case, he was a

Gumbi: Young

Bryan Stabbe: To learn Steve Young

Gumbi: Fantastic exam, Brady.

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah. Yeah, exactly.

Bryan Stabbe: Some guys are just not equipped to go straight from college to being a starter in the league period. And that's not an indictment on them because

Bryan Stabbe: The fact is, if, if you're Dwayne Haskins and you're at Ohio State. And one of the games on your schedule is against Oh, say, the University of male

Bryan Stabbe: who maybe has one or two players on their roster who will be NFL players and it's more likely than not, that those guys will be wide receivers, because for whatever reason they are only these days are only able to turn out wider secrecy.

Gumbi: Marilyn saw use the word we. That's correct. We push out

Gumbi: quarterbacks from the past and wide receivers for the future. That's what Maryland does right now.

Bryan Stabbe: Hey, hey Bay Bay, you know, like

Bryan Stabbe: Hey there was a period of time where there were some pretty solid linebackers coming out of there. You get to come back and he got EJ Henderson. This is my favorite.

Bryan Stabbe: Thought I'd like to talk about Maryland football players from like 2003

Gumbi: Even though we never want anything, man. We got some good players come out of there.

Bryan Stabbe: Oh yeah, they went and got their teeth kicked in by Steve Spurrier and the Orange Bowl that one time. Orange Bowl Peach Bowl. It was the beach ball.

Gumbi: Ball, the Orange Bowl. We actually I think the Tennessee and with the region and did a good job.

Gumbi: All of us let's let's focus right back let's fall

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah I know I can do.

Gumbi: What do Maryland talk later.

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah yeah that's that's our next. Our next

Bryan Stabbe: All that is to say so. Dwayne Haskins an entire game he played in college. I assume he played Maryland because they're in

Gumbi: It. He did.

Bryan Stabbe: So he played he played an entire game against a non NFL caliber defense and that's like maybe will say 7% of the entirety of his college career was spent preparing for a non NFL defense he immediately goes to the NFL, where

Bryan Stabbe: The guys he were he was playing he's playing against now maybe one or two of them. He played against while he was in college like Penn State maybe turns out

Bryan Stabbe: Three or four good defensive players Michigan usually put some guys in the Lake Michigan State okay you can

Bryan Stabbe: You can game plan for one or two really solid defenders, but when every single guy you're playing against it's the, the difference of junior college and the pros is if the College of the pros is not the fifth year of college. It is

Bryan Stabbe: No different thing.

Gumbi: But less than, less than a

Gumbi: Simpson 1%

Gumbi: Of college kids make the NFL.

Bryan Stabbe: Right.

Gumbi: So you're looking at the cream of the crop. So all those players. He went against in the big 10

Gumbi: They and maybe 15 of them maybe 13 or even on a team. Yeah.

Gumbi: Let alone play against him. So you're, you're the cream of the crop everything pops up so you gotta give the guy, an opportunity to learn to adjust

Bryan Stabbe: So there. Yeah, there's no, there's nothing wrong with coming out of college and not being ready to play against NFL players. There's nothing wrong.

Bryan Stabbe: And I know that there are high expectations set by your graph position. He didn't pick where he got drafted. I've heard this before. Actually we I mentioned Doris Heyward Bey, he's actually the example I have in my head. He got picked

Bryan Stabbe: Up by the Oakland Raiders they spent a first round draft pick on him. And I remember that it was one of those situations where they cut to him. This was one of yours. I watched the draft. I don't

Gumbi: Yeah.

Bryan Stabbe: They cut to him and the look on his face is just abject confusion and terror, because I don't think he expected to be picked there it was.

Gumbi: Like zero people expensive to make that high.

Bryan Stabbe: And then, you know, he ended up being an like an okay NFL wide receiver, but like, not, not a great one.

Bryan Stabbe: But people

Gumbi: Still fast.

Bryan Stabbe: People label them a bust. Why, because he got drafted in the first round and wasn't an all pro receiver, it's not his fault that Al Davis was like, like a ghoul like a crypt keeping Google Who da who really likes fast guys don't

Gumbi: Worry. He's got an 83 foot large flame at the ravers ratings rate ravers ruin this. I'm sorry, sorry, sorry, Ranger stadium right now.

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah, well,

Gumbi: At three feet raider stadium.

Gumbi: Out Davis monument sitting there, so he's a goal. Still to this day. Yeah.

Gumbi: It's insane.

Bryan Stabbe: It's haunting Las Vegas, but so it's it's

Gumbi: Not to say that. That's awesome.

Bryan Stabbe: It's not his fault that he was bad or not bad. And there's not as well. That didn't mean expectation

Gumbi: Oh, because he was on. He was on the ship team.

Bryan Stabbe: So similarly Dwayne Haskins was projected out as a, as a first round draft pick, but it's not his fault that he got put into a situation where he just like wasn't really fully equipped to succeed. And right now.

Bryan Stabbe: It seems like they're adding insult to Andrew with him because they are this

Bryan Stabbe: It feels like an additional setback, he should not have played last year. So what do you, what do you benching him for this year. Do you think this makes him better is he better suited now that he's been

Bryan Stabbe: Humiliated. He was voted. He was voted a captain by players on this team like two months ago.

Gumbi: He pushed all when cobra, was it he was trying to pull everything together. He was having camps.

Gumbi: In different places. He was trying to make everyone work together and you've just taken him and you have just disintegrated.

Gumbi: All of the good merit that he has done over all these months with all the wide receivers all the running backs.

Gumbi: And you've now everyone's now tippy toeing around on everything. Everyone, no one knows what's going to happen next. Does that make people. It's a fight or flight situation agreed, sometimes you got to do it, but you do that with somebody

Gumbi: That's a cancer, you know, somebody that doesn't matter. Here's somebody who's trying to be a leader who's working hard, who tried to put it all together for everybody.

Gumbi: And you took that away from him and you broke him down and now he's like a second string if you had put them on second string you would say you need to learn, you need to learn, learn more. Okay, I'm gonna hold the clipboard try no

Gumbi: I put you at third string, you're done with this team now married. That's what was said you are no longer important enough to be on this team.

Gumbi: You are just barely above a scout team. Don't worry about picking up a clipboard. Don't worry about putting on a helmet. Good luck. The rest of the season.

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah and you know there's an A, not too dissimilar example that I think we can look to, and Josh Rosen, who was drafted.

Bryan Stabbe: As a highly touted you know first round guy. I didn't work out for him in Arizona. They cut bait.

Bryan Stabbe: He goes to because he gets replaced by color Murray, the you get sent over to the dolphins ends up being

Bryan Stabbe: benched in favor of Ryan Fitzpatrick, and then they bring in to. And so now he's just sort of like floating around like I don't. He's never going to be a service wonderful quarterback. It's just because he's been totally beat to death and so

Gumbi: Competence level you need

Bryan Stabbe: To

Gumbi: Be a quarterback and you take you taking that away.

Bryan Stabbe: It feels. The other thing with all this, it feels

Bryan Stabbe: Let's say for the sake of argument that this move by Ron Rivera is to try to to motivate him somehow it just sort of feels like a. It's kind of a dubious way to motivate a guy who you know is like really, it sort of seems like doing his best and

Bryan Stabbe: I'll say this. So Ron Rivera seems to me.

Bryan Stabbe: To be

Bryan Stabbe: A reasonable guy in so far as like a professional football coach can be like, they're all lunatics. But if they're already like different brands of lunatics. There's like

Bryan Stabbe: You know, there's like Joe Gibbs who's like sleeping in his office and then there's like Pete Carroll who's like a 911 truth or like they're just like different

Bryan Stabbe: Heights of lunatic.

Bryan Stabbe: Compared to the US to example.

Bryan Stabbe: Seems like

Bryan Stabbe: Like a pretty good guy like

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah, like he wears transition lenses. It's weird, but like he seems OK.

Gumbi: You know, so he's like the cool uncle uncle. Yeah, it makes sense.

Bryan Stabbe: I feel it wasn't my I'll be honest, it wasn't my first choice to be their coach, I'm

Gumbi: It seems like we we recycled another someone else's good coach for the 90th time this team.

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah, and I mean if I had my. If I had my druthers, I would have picked Eric Bimini from from Kansas City. I think he would have been a fantastic. It's, it's kind of appalling to me that he didn't get an opportunity to be a head coach after basically molding.

Bryan Stabbe: Patrick Moore homes and do a Super Bowl winning quarterback.

Bryan Stabbe: It. There are

Gumbi: What we do. I mean, we had all these and again this is we're not, we should have a whole conversation about the coaches, because we had one of the best coaching pedigrees lined up through our system five to seven years ago and we let them all walk out the door.

Bryan Stabbe: On McVeigh, I mean Loeffler up and Green Bay is having like one of the best starts of any any coach in the history of the NFL.

Gumbi: Now Shanahan went to a Super Bowl like

Bryan Stabbe: Like, yep.

Gumbi: We're, we're looking at, like, and that whole pedigrees there and we let it go because of egos because we can't get out of her own damn way.

Gumbi: And this seems like we have once again fallen into that shitty trap of falling into our own recycling or reback going to what we've done every single time. Here we go again and

Bryan Stabbe: It's, it's tough for me to say this because it feels completely defeatist, and I know that I've been a bit of a downer here i'm just i'm saying how I feel this is we're trying to keep it real. Gotta

Gumbi: Do what you gotta do it.

Bryan Stabbe: But part of me in the back of my head is like, okay, let's say they had made Sean McVeigh, the head coach or let's say they had made

Bryan Stabbe: The younger Shanahan a head coach.

Gumbi: The Kyle. Yeah.

Bryan Stabbe: I part of me feels like

Bryan Stabbe: It may not have made the difference. We talked about this a couple weeks ago because with the Browns like the Browns of the Browns like is the Washington football team like

Bryan Stabbe: As long as, as long as insiders here. It kind of feels like they just have like, you know, and in peanuts like and Charlie Brown. There's that kid pig pen.

Bryan Stabbe: And pig pen has like just that dirt cloud that hangs around you. Just like a dirty small child, which is this. There's a lot to unpack there. I remember

Bryan Stabbe: It's, it's sort of feels like is there, like, okay, if cam had been here. We're gonna deal with hypothetical here if Kevin been here, would they be much better. I think probably slightly. Yes.

Gumbi: Absolutely, yes.

Bryan Stabbe: Well, like I don't know. I don't know if they're turning it around and like really figuring it out like is is

Bryan Stabbe: Is it so systemic that they couldn't succeed. Even if you picked a different coach and a different roster of a team that was successful. I don't know the answer to that, if feels that way.

Gumbi: I think you're right. I think that feeling is is is long and this is the hard part. And I'm gonna kind of loop it all back together as long as we have an owner like Dan Snyder.

Gumbi: Yeah, I love it. Like if we love as long as we have Dan Snyder, we are in a situation. We're going to constantly repeat ourselves. Yeah.

Gumbi: The draft pick

Gumbi: I guess was 15th for Dwayne Haskins that we took that day was not a Washington football club or previous never name was, it wasn't a Jay Gruden pick it wasn't a offensive pick it was a Dan Snyder pick

Gumbi: Yeah, as long as we have him in control of this team.

Gumbi: We can expect this disappointment, this being upset and this type of just pure your hatred for what's happening to continue over and over again. We're afraid we're fans because we're fanatics.

Gumbi: Sure. He's an owner

Gumbi: Who's taking that away from us.

Bryan Stabbe: Fandom is not rational. It's not

Gumbi: Not

Bryan Stabbe: There's no we're sitting here, we're trying to have a degree of rationality, but we recognize, like if you're still fan of this team after the last 25 years like there's probably something wrong with you, it's okay.

Gumbi: All wrong with me.

Bryan Stabbe: We're here to

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah, well, you know, it's like okay if let's say Duane Haskins had gone had been had been picked by the giants like some people thought it was going to like, would they be better off. Would he be better off. I don't know.

Bryan Stabbe: I don't know, but it just sort of feels, it feels like we're in a spin cycle. It just feels so like we've been here before. It feels like we're going to be here again and on today of all days were sort of, it's still feels really fresh

Bryan Stabbe: You know, you kind of just got a lingering end of those feelings and scream into the abyss and then have yourself a drink and just just get back after

Gumbi: The I think the we've said it before, and that's where we're kind of looking around and the reality is, is that before this season started before we beat the Eagles in week one.

Gumbi: This team has become exactly who we thought they were

Bryan Stabbe: Sure, yeah.

Gumbi: And and it's disappointing that is you said three I said five wins. And it looks like I'm on the wrong end of that.

Gumbi: Now we have a quarterback change.

Gumbi: We're having a team change.

Gumbi: And I think all of us are in dismay right now.

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah, well, so okay let's let's close out with this, with this question. What do you see as the end game. What's the endgame because the end game before was an evaluation and it was a rebuild it was, what do we have and what are we doing about it who stays who goes

Bryan Stabbe: That has seemingly been turned on its head.

Bryan Stabbe: Because this sort of feels like something that's going to be incredibly hard to come back from

Bryan Stabbe: You know wins and losses aside.

Bryan Stabbe: I think they have made the the first part, the ability to evaluate

Bryan Stabbe: Much more challenging because let's say at the end of the year. You learn what have we learned we learned that maybe Kyle Allen is not an starting NFL quarterback. I think people would have made that same estimation before the season started but

Bryan Stabbe: A great, well, you go into Haskins year two and a half for a year, three at the end of this year.

Bryan Stabbe: What have you learned so far. I just, that's really what comes back to me is like, and

Bryan Stabbe: I'll be honest, I don't really have a good answer for this question because I don't really now know what the end game is

Bryan Stabbe: Based on this, he'll turn that we've seen today.

Gumbi: When you're in the thick of it as an athlete.

Gumbi: Every day, your desire your goals are to win sure there's nothing else. There's nothing else. You are literally blinders on about winning

Gumbi: Ron Rivera is an athlete. He was an athlete for years and years and years.

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah.

Gumbi: He's now looking at this opportunity to win a division.

Gumbi: Which which again, that puts you that put something in your pocket. That's like, hey, I've won something

Gumbi: He's now not thinking about the short term, I mean the long term, he's done with the short term.

Gumbi: Yeah, here's my opportunity. What can I do to make that opportunity happen. What can I do to win.

Gumbi: Here's the problem is that this isn't college. This isn't high school. This is the NFL where sometimes you have to overlook that desire to win short term for long term glory.

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah.

Gumbi: And again, the blinders are on. You see this opportunity, you want to grab that Grail, you want to hold on to and say, look what I did.

Gumbi: But it's seven and nine winning a division. You didn't really deserve it at seven and nine going to a playoffs and getting blown out by another team 42 to 10 you really didn't deserve it.

Gumbi: Take the opportunity learn who your young guys are

Gumbi: coddle them help them make them better so that we have a team 234 years from now. That's so much better than what we're watching now. Yeah.

Gumbi: Sometimes you have to go through a little bit of shit to get to better to be clean. On the other end Shawshank and

Gumbi: That's where we're at, but Ron is lost that for weeks. And when I have a chance to win the division. Yeah. And that makes zero sense

Gumbi: I don't want a division banner up I want Super Bowls. I want opportunities for us to be in circles. I want us to know that we're in the NFC Championship

Gumbi: And again, if we lose. Let us lose by by three points and make it heartfelt because we know we're close. We're not close. That's not the team. We have that's not who we are right now and they are exactly who we said the end think they are. This is not a winning team.

No.

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah, and

Bryan Stabbe: When like when winning was like losing like you're really a loser. And right now, maybe they maybe they do get a game better, but the it's a, you know, not seeing the forest for the trees. It really feels that way. It really feels very short sighted and

Bryan Stabbe: Ah, I think.

Bryan Stabbe: We are programmed to not give this team. The benefit of the doubt.

Bryan Stabbe: I think that's going to take a lot to overcome and this, this doesn't help. It doesn't make me feel more like it doesn't make me feel like the decision making has improved.

Bryan Stabbe: We're not there every day, you know, for better, you know, of course.

Bryan Stabbe: But it doesn't seem like there is any set of circumstances where they can, like, come back from this, let's say doing Haskins those really well in practice, like always been really trying has been figuring out in practice.

Bryan Stabbe: Like, that's not enough like the only way now feels like that Kyle Allen doesn't

Bryan Stabbe: doesn't start for the same for a while his injury.

Bryan Stabbe: You know,

Bryan Stabbe: Just like being worse than Dwayne Haskins has

Bryan Stabbe: Been over the next four games.

Bryan Stabbe: And I will tell you.

Bryan Stabbe: I think we will see Alex Smith at some point under center this year.

Gumbi: Yeah, well,

Um,

Bryan Stabbe: I don't feel great about that we'll, we'll sort of cross that bridge when we get there. It's kind of scary prospects to even consider I just it it really feels. Whereas before, I think this is the most distinct I can put it where I was before the direction we were going

Bryan Stabbe: Didn't feel great. I feel like we're going through choppy waters, it at least felt like there was a direction, but now it feels a little bit more like a rudderless yeah

Gumbi: We had wind at our back. We had no idea. We had a plan. The winds gone the writers gone now we're just sitting there. Yeah. However, as a fan. You know, it makes me so much happier this season.

Bryan Stabbe: What would make you so much happier.

Gumbi: If we had last game at our FK

Bryan Stabbe: Yes. And that is our, which is to say, the Washington football team should play one more game and our FK we've seen the hashtags. We know that some of you are paying attention.

Gumbi: I shut off a

Bryan Stabbe: Lot. One last one more game. Okay. Well, get away when I read it up in the show notes. Okay, I would. Don't put me on the spot.

Bryan Stabbe: Oh boy, I am exhausted.

Gumbi: It's been a long day and it's

Gumbi: Not even over yet.

Bryan Stabbe: A very long day.

Gumbi: Oh,

Bryan Stabbe: I will say, I first of all, I appreciate a everyone has been listening. You've given us great feedback. We hear you. We see you. We appreciate you. I appreciate

Bryan Stabbe: Everyone who's been reading on hogs Haven. We know that you're all lunatics just like us and we love you for it. Just be a little bit nicer to each other in the comments section. The moderating thing is it's it's okay like

Gumbi: It's hard afraid to lose it on us just not on each other.

Bryan Stabbe: We know you know like the commenting new commenting thing like there's nothing you can do about it. I'm sorry, it's, it's not going to go back to the way it was. Stay with us. Okay, hang with us. We're doing our best. The team.

Bryan Stabbe: Is doing something and you're still paying attention. If you haven't stopped paying attention by now. I don't think there's really anything that they could do. Or we could do, or anyone could do to make you stop.

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah, you

Gumbi: You've got your just keep drinking particular yeah let's just

Bryan Stabbe: Just have a drink. Go for a walk. Go read a book. It'll. It'll be okay. All right.

Gumbi: It'll be okay. Yeah. It'll be okay.

Bryan Stabbe: And of course coming, I appreciate you. Thank you for taking this time to to rant and rave with me. There are very few people on this planet who I feel I can really just yell and scream and pull what's left of my hair out and

Bryan Stabbe: And I can see you do the exact same thing. It is funny that we both put our hands on our temples. Oh, that

Gumbi: was hysterical. That was not planned that was ridiculous and Bryan, I appreciate you because you allow all this to happen. And again, sometimes it's good to get a little appreciation. So, sir. I appreciate you.

Bryan Stabbe: Yeah, well, we'll keep this train rolling sometimes trains or train wrecks and you just can't look away. And that's kind of where I'm at right now.

Gumbi: Yeah, let's let's go off the cliff. But here we go.

Bryan Stabbe: Whoa, boy. Alright, so for for Gumby, you've got Bryan from hogs Haven and you have been listening to

Gumbi: The cult of cult.