Hogs Haven Community GM: Guard
by Parks Smith on Jun 30, 2011 9:54 AM EDT
Email
PrintOnce again, Hogs Haven has spoken and signed former 49er Aubrayo Franklin to a 4 year, $8 million dollar deal. I must say that if we add a big name wide receiver tomorrow, this team will be looking Vinny-tastic! Personally I like the Franklin signing, but I would have liked to see some more money saved at cornerback and right tackle. Oh well, we'll save the analysis for the end of the exercise.
After starting out with a cool $66 million in our pockets, we are now down to $41 million. Here is a look at our three signings:
Players Signed
Ryan Harris, RT: 6 Years, $5 Million
Jonathan Joseph, CB: 6 Years, $12 Million
Aubrayo Franklin, NT: 4 Years, $8 Million
Let us shape this baby up and get away from the rotting stinky stank of the Vinny-meister. Today we will look at guards, but tomorrow will be the true test when we examine wide receivers. Cheers!
115 comments
|
0 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
Once again, I find myself voting "No One", though we are hardly set at Guard
I just don’t want to commit to any of these guys since I HOPE we will draft at least one rookie stud next season to play inside. If I had to pick one of these guys just to keep from standing pat with a horrendous line, I would take Yanda…seems like some upside there.
But I feel like we already have a couple guys who probably give us what these other guys would give us.
You do realize that we are going HAVE to spend money with the new CBA?
So who do you suggest we do it on if you keep voting “no one”?
Editor at Hogs Haven - Redskins Blog
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
by Parks Smith on Jun 30, 2011 10:42 AM EDT up reply actions
what's the salary floor?
Are we anywhere near it?
"By far the worst performers on the (Redskins) are in the front office." – Sally Jenkins
I defer to Steveo
Editor at Hogs Haven - Redskins Blog
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
by Parks Smith on Jun 30, 2011 11:27 AM EDT up reply actions
have been curious about that myself....
there are a lot of variables. How are we going to structure the contracts? Are we keeping in mind that we are probably going to be offering a top dollar contract to a QB within the next 2 years. Really impossible to do without all the info laid out in front of you at once, something I don’t have the time or inclination to do.
Are we keeping in mind that we are probably going to be offering a top dollar contract to a QB within the next 2 years.
We are? Who? Drew Brees? You have to remember the rookie wage scale, we’re not going to be spending a ton of money on a QB if he’s a draft pick.
Editor at Hogs Haven - Redskins Blog
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
by Parks Smith on Jun 30, 2011 11:33 AM EDT up reply actions
Unless you want to take a shot at Brees. Whatever floats your boat #9.
I got a little excited to talk about rookie wage scales!
Editor at Hogs Haven - Redskins Blog
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
by Parks Smith on Jun 30, 2011 11:43 AM EDT up reply actions
there are without a doubt a lot of variables
but the point is anyway you cut it we have money to spend unless we just sign the top 3 guys on the market. Right now we are using a simple equal salary rate, but I don’t think there is an issue with that. If we did anything it would be to front load contracts (an extra couple mil. in the first two years, so the rest of the deal is cheaper).
Also if we are smart we will resign Landry and Fletcher now, when we can use this year’s impressive cap room to make them cheaper in the future as well.
Anyway you cut it though we will have a ton of money to spend on between 5-9 very good free agents. The exact number will depend on who we get and how much they cost.
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
by Steve Shoup on Jun 30, 2011 11:47 AM EDT up reply actions
Extend Landry
I agree that extending Landry’s contract this year makes sense. It avoids potential bidding wars next year, and can bring us closer to the salary floor for this year.
A Redskin Potato
by Mr PotatoHead on Jun 30, 2011 12:50 PM EDT up reply actions
Idk Landry still hasn't impressed me enough.
I don’t know what the safety market looks like next, and that would sway my opinion. Landry certainly looked better last year, but he needs to continue that in my opinion. Stop over-pursuing and going for the big hit. O and act like you’ve been there before, stop celebrating on 20 yard gains.
Editor at Hogs Haven - Redskins Blog
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
So, you elect to wait until value is high and leverage low before extending him?
That’s how you get in Cap hell.
Extend LaRon with leftover Cap; same with Fred Davis.
No Danny, Nooooooo - Tom Landry, 1982., and Washington Redskins fans, 1999-
No not really, its better to lock him up now for sure.
I’m just saying, I don’t know how good he is long term. He seems to be learning, I just hope the trend continues.
Editor at Hogs Haven - Redskins Blog
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
again though why do we care what the salary floor is, esp. if it is only a million or two difference from the Cap
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
Yes, and spending something like a 12 and four 8s would still leave us with about 22 mill left
for others – like three 5s and seven 1s. I.e., a lot of flexibility and plenty of muscle to get those 5-9 very good free agents. I just hope Bruce is aggressive, as he says he will be, and gets us some good players. The HH FA signings going on now are a good place to start.
agreed
I mean when it is all said and done I’d like to only spend say $45-50 million of that $66 on players, and use the rest to front load some of their contracts and/or extend players. That is like getting an extra $16 million of cap room in the future, which would be genius.
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
Parks went with a $125 million cap (which i believe now to be a very likely scenario)
so the Floor is going to be at a bare minimum $112.5 (using the old formula). While it is unclear of what it will be in the new CBA it will without a doubt be raised (as has been talked about). It might not end up being a % as much as a simple ‘$2-5 million under the cap’. Regardless I would say there is no way that it is less that $120 million (again based on a $125 million cap).
Regardless we aren’t even close to the Salary Floor at this point. Also, even if we could spend $10-15 million less this year. Why would we?? It isn’t like baseball where the Nats can save up money not spent on payroll to ensure they can spend in the future. If we don’t spend this money it will go to waste.
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
by Steve Shoup on Jun 30, 2011 11:42 AM EDT up reply actions
that is roughly what it was under the old CBA, and every report/rumor has it being a lot closer in this one
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
I think the new CBA might penalize teams for last year.
I have no idea how the league will resolve last year’s contracts, specifically reworking Hall and Haynesworth’s renogiated deals. The team will also likey have to eat dead cap space, possibly McNabb’s new deal, and Portis among others. The Redskins hedged their bets last year as they had a very high cap number, that might prove to be a costly penalty this year.
Allen did a tremendous job of clearing the books last season, and the team purposely kept new contracts down. But, there was no way of knowing how the new CBA would respond to 2010, and how it will count dead money, bonuses, renegotiated deals, and the like going forward.
If the cap is $120M this season, we might be a lot closer to that than we think.
I don't think there is any way that a new CBA would punish deals like last year.
At least 2/3 of the league last year negotiated similar types of bonuses as Haynesworth and Hall, so they’d only be punishing themselves. And the players wouldn’t want it b/c they would giving up more money, b/c so much Cap money around the league would be eaten up by that penalty.
As for the rest, yes I agree that we don’t know how the dead cap will work, either in regard for guys cut pre lockout, or guys we’d move after. Sure that could eat up some of the cap, but I think it will affect all teams to some degree, so it might not have as much of a negative impact as you believe.
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
I don't think there will be a 'punishment' per se.
I do think there will be some type of accounting or rollover of those large payouts. Hall, Haynesworth, and McNabb’s deals do involve a bonus payment, and could be pro-rated this year, and possibly next. Those pro-rations should add about $10-12M to the cap number this year, regardless of any additional ‘penalties’.
I’m no salary cap or contract expert, but it looks to me like the Skins are in the $90M neighborhood, with rookies, and without McNabb. I believe the Skins will stay closer to the floor then to the ceiling, and $110M looks about like the floor. We’ll have to wait for the new CBA for further direction, but I’m guessing the team will be looking to spend no more than $25M.
The front office of Allen and M. Shanahan gave all indications that they would be aggressive in free
agency. The Cowboys are already over $125 million. After all the ands, ifs, and buts the Skins will not be more worse off than most teams. The end result may be cheaper free agent signings and more older players cut from NFL rosters. A better idea of the situation will be known by early September.
by Jefferson1935 on Jul 1, 2011 7:45 PM EDT up reply actions
That FA window's going to be short and furious
i just hope we keep our heads.
The Redskins need to tread very carefully thru free agency.....
this year, in my opinion. Next year’s crop of free agents includes Carriker, F.Davis, Fletcher (or his replacement), Landry, Lichtensteiger, and Montgomery among others. The team also has no franchise Qb.
In my opinion, Allen should stay to the floor this season as to allow for the expanded contracts of Landry, at least one of the guards (or a replacement free agent), possibly Carriker and/or Davis, a stud middle linebacker, and of course a franchise Qb. If Allen boxes himself in this year with an exuberance of spending, it likely will mean subtractions next year.
Any bonus money used this year to entice potential targets will also count against the cap next year and thereafter. And with the 30% rule, you can only front load a contract so much before you strangle yourself.
Vinnie and Danny would gladly max out the cap this season, hopefully Bruce and Mike know better.
by JDC15 on Jul 3, 2011 1:10 PM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
I somewhat agree,
but I voted no-one because I am still banging the ‘continuity at O-Line’ drum. I think we keep the OL the same, with a replacement at C (Monty?), and draft necessary parts next season. (No exclamation points here, ha).
I think it was Tandler, but somebody posted an article discussing the O-line, and
stressed how important continuity was. I’d still beef it up, big time, but continuity is an option.
5 paper bags with experience together doesn't equal continuity
Editor at Hogs Haven - Redskins Blog
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
To Parks and Steveo,
the shanahan offensive line scheme is notoriously hard to learn in a single season. Almost all OL groups struggle in their first year in it (check Minnesota), and improve a lot more the next year. I was not particularly happy with the OL but I am pretty certain that blowing up this OL and bringing in more players who don’t know the scheme will be ‘shooting ourselves in the foot’. I believe we give this line another season, and then it will be painfully obvious where our weak spots on the line are, remember that this group improved a lot by seasons end and will hopefully continue on that improvement.
by Toosy_13 on Jun 30, 2011 4:44 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
the shanahan offensive line scheme is notoriously hard to learn in a single season.
According to who? Was there evidence of this in Denver?
I believe we give this line another season, and then it will be painfully obvious where our weak spots on the line are, remember that this group improved a lot by seasons end and will hopefully continue on that improvement.
They did? What group? It changed just about every game. Evaluations and decision need to be made now. ShanAllen doesn’t have a year to sit around and see if these wet paper bags pan out. That would just start another cycle of “difficult” learning by your account.
Editor at Hogs Haven - Redskins Blog
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
I can't see how anyone could say that it took awhile to learn
since when Alex Gibbs brought it to the Broncos with Shanny in 95, Denver was top 10 in just about every offensive category including top 5 in rushing yards, and 2nd overall in yards per attempts. That was the first year any of those players had to know that system, and as for it being a cohesive group, it featured 3 new starters.
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
Torain would've easily rushed for 1000 yards if he had played
16 games this season, and if you look at Hugh Millen (Denver’s backup QB in ‘95) he was sacked 9.1% for every attempt. The reason I use Millen (although I accept that I have no idea what situations Millen was played in) is that he is not JOHN ELWAY, now we were hoping that McNabb would be our Elway but that didn’t pan out, hence the reason for the 7.3% sack per attempt and Grossman’s 6.3% sack per attempt. (Taken off of PFF)
My head just exploded.
Editor at Hogs Haven - Redskins Blog
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
wait what??
Millen had less than 45 dropbacks and you are going to use him as a basis for how ‘bad’ that line struggled…not to mention the fact that is HUGH MILLEN.
Sure Torain might have gone over a 1,000, but if he was actually healthy to play the full season his YPC would have gone down, and probably dramatically. His numbers are highly inflated from that Tampa game, where he got 23% of his overall rushing total. If you eliminate the carries and the yards from that game Torain is a 4.0 ypc for the year. So yes that game did influence things greatly.
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
by Steve Shoup on Jul 1, 2011 10:52 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I use Millen due to the fact that the other QB is Elway,
guys like Elway and Roethlisberger don’t need good lines because of their style, and that leaves Millen.
Secondly, I would bet my life that Torain makes 1000+ yards easily if he had started 16 games instead of 8!
Do you really not believe that the ‘95 Bronco’s line looks better when the team has 3 HoF calibre players in Elway, Davis and Sharpe?
Every player on this list above is far more advanced than Licht, Rabach or Monty
so how is signing one of them ‘shooting ourselves in the foot’
Yes I don’t think you just sign a player to sign a player, because regardless of how good they are if they don’t fit your scheme they are going to struggle, but you can’t bury your head in the sand. Talent is 9 times out of 10 the most important aspect in whether a player can play or not.
How is it not painfully obvious where are weak spots are now?? We had a bottom five O-line in just about every category last year so I think we have our answer. Of that group only Williams has the pedigree and potential to be a starting (and hopefully much more) caliber o-lineman. The game seems to have past Rabach and Brown (not to mention the injuries) by and Licht and Monty are stop gap options at best (and only Monty was close to that level last year).
I don’t think there is much evidence that our O-line improved last year, outside of the fact that we had a big running day against the Bucs. I don’t think we can put much stock in that since it was one game, and their two starting DT’s were out.
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
continuity and development only work if you have something to build and develop
when we don’t have talent we are just going to get killed.
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
Hicks/Licht 4life!
"By far the worst performers on the (Redskins) are in the front office." – Sally Jenkins
I bet you regret getting that tatoo this time last year.
Editor at Hogs Haven - Redskins Blog
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
by Parks Smith on Jun 30, 2011 11:34 AM EDT up reply actions
Might as well be a bullseye
Editor at Hogs Haven - Redskins Blog
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
by Parks Smith on Jun 30, 2011 11:48 AM EDT up reply actions
Yanda
Move Licht or Monty to center for the year, draft a C/G next year with our second pick since our first will be going to a QB.
Williams, Licht, monty, yanda, harris
Then insert draft pick next year to whoever is the weak link between Monty and Licht, my guess is bye bye Lichtensteiger. Doesn’t sound like too bad of a plan?
"You're fucking out!"
^^^ Like this plan.
StephenBeagrie on Twitter and Facebook.
www.culturebully.com
www.stevebeagrie.com
by Stephen Beagrie on Jun 30, 2011 11:06 AM EDT up reply actions
I like it too
nice mix – only two new guys – maintains some continuity.
Is continuity the word of the day?
Editor at Hogs Haven - Redskins Blog
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
I'm not sure
But I might as well mention it one more time, just to keep up the continuity..
by willster on Jun 30, 2011 3:41 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
haha +1
Editor at Hogs Haven - Redskins Blog
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
First, the coaches need to give up on Rabach as the starter. A new continuity at the center position needs to be established.
I am not convinced that Harris will be any better than Jammal Brown as he finished the 2010 season.
by Jefferson1935 on Jun 30, 2011 11:10 AM EDT up reply actions
Kind of my thoughts, too, except I would have gone larger than Harris (i.e., I liked Free)
Trying to rebuild the Oline for our QB next year, and yes, a 2nd round Center/Guard was in the plans.
I’d be good with Blalock, too, instead of Yanda.
Considering that I’m going Santana and Rex for the WR and QB, I feel ok going after a few key OLinemen.
No Danny, Nooooooo - Tom Landry, 1982., and Washington Redskins fans, 1999-
I think Free is overrated
but I like the idea of signing him or at least driving his price up if for nothing else than fucking with Dallas.
That's another benefit of going after Free.
He’s at least one of the top guys at Tackle, and he would be super fired up to go against a team we play twice a year. Win-Win
No Danny, Nooooooo - Tom Landry, 1982., and Washington Redskins fans, 1999-
Yanda.
I realise we’re running out of cash, but he’s the guy. He could probably play Tackle too.
When we get to WR, it might take a hometown discount for Moss to get us under this imaginary cap!
StephenBeagrie on Twitter and Facebook.
www.culturebully.com
www.stevebeagrie.com
by Stephen Beagrie on Jun 30, 2011 11:06 AM EDT reply actions
honestly not even close to running out of cash
As Parks said through the first 3 signings the Skins would still have $41 million left, after Yanda they’d have $35 million. That is still a ton of Cap room
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
by Steve Shoup on Jun 30, 2011 11:49 AM EDT up reply actions
Don't worry that Sidney Rice 12 year, $35 mil per year contract will gobble that right up.
Editor at Hogs Haven - Redskins Blog
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
by Parks Smith on Jun 30, 2011 11:51 AM EDT up reply actions
Tiller negotiating deals again??
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
by Steve Shoup on Jun 30, 2011 11:54 AM EDT up reply actions
Yea, using his abacus from Penn State Wilkes-Barre campus
Editor at Hogs Haven - Redskins Blog
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
by Parks Smith on Jun 30, 2011 12:00 PM EDT up reply actions
Yes - They should not snatch defeat from the jaws of victory
by doing something like that.
It would be good for...wait, wait CONTINUITY!
Editor at Hogs Haven - Redskins Blog
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
went with joseph
i have had joseph and harris on my own list for a while,i like yanda but i think b-more will keep him,it doesnt seem as if they will just let him walk .with bruce allen being here people dont realize that suddenly we have a bit of a pipeline to tampa bay free agents based on his relationship with those players and the fact that he drafted most of them, which is similar to the pipeline we have with broncos players based on shanny being here or texans players based on them being familiar with kyle and his system,or haslett for that matter(i.e. carriker and otogwe), but i like yanda and josesph,i just think we will have a better chance of prying joseph away based on the fact that they have already put their money into jeremy trueblood and i dont think they will over extend themselves to keep joseph.and the other guys on the list dont really fit or are a little more risky or way more expensive thean these two guys.
I went with Yanda
I’ve obviously been a big proponent of his for sometime and think he should probably be our top FA target overall. And I would even say that getting into a bidding war over him would be worth it. Yanda has quietly played at a Pro Bowl level (at two different positions no less) these last couple of seasons, and is well worth the price.
I know Joseph gets a lot of support, and somewhat b/c of the Bruce Allen connection but I don’t get it. Joseph has showed a lot of promise, but he has had an up and down career, and is coming off a really bad season. Sure he could bounce back, but he is the type of FA signing who could be really good one year, and down right awful the next. Personally I’d stay away.
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
There can only be one...
And Yanda is his name. This is the FA we need do whatever we can to secure. If you put him with RT Harris, we have a great right side for years to come (not withstanding any injuries).
If, for any reason, he was not available, Dahl has the demeanor I love, NASTY!! He would be a great addition. Another would be Chris Chester (B-More), whom Yanda beat out two years ago. Don’t let Joseph fool you. He is a great RG, but he does not fit the scheme (Zone) that Shanny runs. All I know is, it is imperative to solidify our OL, and by adding Harris and Yanda, we will begin the process.
scratch my head...
Anyone who votes for “Do Nothing” must be a Cowboys lover.
by jgibbsfan1 on Jun 30, 2011 12:15 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
agree that or Eagles trolls
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
or Ken
Editor at Hogs Haven - Redskins Blog
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
Yanda won't be available
Ravens officials have informed free agent G/T Marshal Yanda that they intend to sign him to a long-term deal. Yanda will be Baltimore’s No. 1 priority in free agency, ahead of Jared Gaither, Chris Carr, Josh Wilson, Marc Bulger, and Donte’ Stallworth. “He’s a dominant puller. He’s physical,” said coach John Harbaugh of Yanda earlier this offseason. “If you can put a nice, big right tackle next to him, that would really help.” Jun. 28 – 10:15 am et
@Diesel__44 on the twitter machine.
Diesel we've got the Ravens for tampering! Good job.
Editor at Hogs Haven - Redskins Blog
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
I didn't think you could tamper with your own players.
Until the new CBA, theoretically he’s still a Raven.
No Danny, Nooooooo - Tom Landry, 1982., and Washington Redskins fans, 1999-
you can't discuss any contract parameters or well anything football related to anyone as long as there is a lockout
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
I don't think Yanda will be an easy sign, but I think he is worth it
whether it is giving him a much larger total package, or just front loading the money, (say 20 million in the first two years all guaranteed) it might be enough to convince him not to sign with Baltimore. The Ravens don’t have nearly the cap room the Skins have, and they have some other serious FA’s this year. They also have guys like Grubbs, Birk, Rice, R. Lewis, and others who will be FA’s next year. I don’t know if they would be willing to match that kinda rate. Baltimore will likely look to back load any contracts since they need to address so many of their own guys, meaning the Redskins should have a big advantage.
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
found this on the ES website. (props to PFF and stevemcqueen)
Davin has the potential to be a TERRIBLE signing and fit for our ZBS.
Originally Posted by PFF
Right guard Davin Joseph (-6.3) was shameful against the Cardinals, getting no push in the running game (-4.2 run blocking) and being a complete liability in pass protection. He gave up one hit and three pressures in just 29 pass attempts (-2.4 in pass pro). Joseph now ranks dead last (77th) of all OGs who have played at least 25 percent of snaps.
Originally Posted by PFF from yet another “had a bad day article”
Right Guard — Davin Joseph, Tampa Bay (-6.3)
One of the more baffling things is how Joseph has built a reputation as a good player. This was another shoddy display and I implore anyone who thinks highly of him to watch the tape of him against the Cardinals.
Originally Posted by PFF in still another “had a bad day article, the third I found”
Davin Joseph (-5.5, Tampa Bay)
Rounding the unit up is perennial poor performer Joseph, who was particularly poor in giving up 5 pressures and was overmatched against some of the powerful Cleveland defenders.
Originally Posted by PFF
Also landing in the bottom five we’ve got a Pittsburgh Steeler in Chris Kemoeatu. The former Super Bowl champ had a particularly rough playoff series, where the Jets (in particular Trevor Pryce) and B.J. Raji of the Packers really took him to town. That pushed his PBE rating higher than Davin Joseph, a player who has rarely lived up to the hype that has surrounded him. Only three of the games he started (not including his eight snap day in Week 12) ended with him giving up just one pressure, with games against Cleveland, Pittsburgh and Arizona resulting in five. Joseph ranked as the 4th worst pass blocking guard last season according to their analysis.
Originally Posted by PFF
Perhaps though, of all in the top five, the name that stands out most is Davin Joseph. The Buc has come in for criticism from me before, and continues to show up on lists like this while some media pundits insist on perpetuating the myth of him as a top guard. He’s not. Joseph also ranked as the 4th worst pass blocking guard in the league the past three seasons (since they started doing their analysis) as well.
Originally Posted by PFF from “repicking the Probowl”
Davin Joseph was called up to replace Leonard Davis, although we’re not sure why. He ranked towards the bottom of all offensive guards, impressing in no areas and giving up 2 pressures per game.
@Diesel__44 on the twitter machine.
Can I change my vote?
I had voted for Joseph. Primarily because I believe it will be easier to pry him away from the Bucs than it will be to pry Yanda away from the BaltiMorons. But now I’ve changed my mind.
YANDA
A Redskin Potato
by Mr PotatoHead on Jun 30, 2011 2:14 PM EDT up reply actions
I've just never been a stats person
I can’t say I’ve watched Joseph play, but I’ve only heard great things about this guy.
but from who??
A ton of news papers and analysts talk about his up and down play
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
He's a guy I haven't seen play much (just like everyone on this board)...
It just goes to show that most are enamored by the big name despite being a good fit or quality addition. Everybody hates Snyder and Cerrato and given the chance (this exercise) they do the same thing.
Btw..I’m not a nerd, I’m a geek. Big difference.
@Diesel__44 on the twitter machine.
by Diesel44 on Jun 30, 2011 7:10 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
Have to agree
It just goes to show that most are enamored by the big name despite being a good fit or quality addition. Everybody hates Snyder and Cerrato and given the chance (this exercise) they do the same thing.
By the time this is over, Hogs Haven will have put the Redskins right back in Salary Cap Hell with a dozen mis-matched pieces who were the “big name, can’t miss FAs” of the moment.
also rec.
by ENsDad27 on Jun 30, 2011 10:01 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
but that is only if chosen poorly. Hopefully our coaches and scouts know what any media source, advanced metric or Tampa fan already knows
Yanda is far superior to Joseph
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
I don't know if that be what hes be saying. Word
Editor at Hogs Haven - Redskins Blog
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
No just that people voting for Joseph believe the hype
Joseph had a more impressive college and draft status, and he is also on a team with few stars or known players (esp. before last year) so when the Bucs played well he get more of the lionshare of credit.
I’m not saying Joseph is awful just that Yanda is a lot better, but that perception goes against general held beliefs. I say Tampa fan, because I think they have more insight to him and quite a few of their bloggers talk about him being overrated.
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
I doubt 1/2 these people voting
know anything about the player they’re voting for, much less the system they have been in. They see the highest priced guy, of the biggest name, and just click vote next to his name. Thats what their used to; can you blame them?
I got Tiger Blood running through my veins!
I agree that Yanda is a far better prospect & fit for our system
& he is one of the very few big name FAs that I think we should be interested in. Joseph would be an upgrade over what we have but would not be worth the price tag. Blalock makes no sense, he would be a terrible fit in a ZBS. It’s really an interesting subject & I like the way that you & Parks have put it together but it is easy to see the Vinny in many people who are voting for these players.
that is b/c I think most people are enamored that he went to Oklahoma or that Allen drafted him
both I think mean nothing in the long run. Brown went to OK and he was awful, and Allen really isn’t the personnel guy so I don’t see how that matters.
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
I'm not gonna lie.
I don’t know who Blalock is. Does he play for the Falcons?
He’s young and cheaper than the rest, so that gets my vote.
"That's what she said!"
yep he plays for the Falcons
he’s been a solid guard for them, but he’s never shown to be more than an above-average to good guard. He is younger but I don’t see much potential left in him. He’d be better than what we would have but on an ideal line he’d be the 4th best lineman.
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
Which is EXACTLY why I voted for him
He’s young, and good. He’s less expensive than others, leaving room for other good players.
Yeah, he may be one of the weaker players on an ideal line…. but he’d be one of the stronger players on our line now.
People tend to forget that Jeff Bostic, well beloved by Redskins fans, was by far the weakest OLineman on our line during the 1988 SB run. Yet he was a hero and one of our stronger players in 1984. We’d upgraded talent in between.
No Danny, Nooooooo - Tom Landry, 1982., and Washington Redskins fans, 1999-
I wouldn't say he is "good" above average is more accurate and he really isn't a ZBS guy
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
I see Redskins Nation
is yet again going for the biggest name at G in the Free Agency pool.
Smart!
I got Tiger Blood running through my veins!
So let's go for the worst guy
And continue mediocrity on our offensive line!
How bout drafting and using our own guys
uch like other successful teams do……………………………wow, now there’s a thought!
I got Tiger Blood running through my veins!
Seeing as how the draft is over...
If we want to improve our O-line this year, we have to do it through free agency.
Without a doubt we have to sign a free agent RT, either our own (Brown) or someone else’s. I don’t think that Capers will be ready to start this year.
I would like them to sign one G in free agency and draft a G and C next year. I would also be happy if they picked up UDFA Kirkpatrick as a project at C.
A Redskin Potato
by Mr PotatoHead on Jun 30, 2011 7:33 PM EDT up reply actions
Both Kirkpatrick and O'Dowd are out there for the pickins
I would perfer O’Dowd, and think hecould be a good starter.
As for Capers, I don’t think it would hurt to give him a try. He’s been a RT, and he’s played in a ZBS. He’s very athletic, and he could be the bookend to TW.
I got Tiger Blood running through my veins!
They are good players
But undrafted for a reason. You can’t tell me you’d expect me them to come in and be an immediate starter. I guess maybe more of a stop-gap or cheaper guy is what you are looking for until we groom a starter, but late round picks and UDFAs aren’t necessarily sure things. I know what you are saying, but if we are trying to build a team for this year, we go for better offensive lineman in free agency. If we are officially in rebuilding mode, I guess we go for the younger guys and build from there. But good teams get FAs too man.
Thats exactly the point
We are not trying to build a team for this year(that was the old way). This team needs to be built for the future.
I have see O’Dowd play many times, and I’ll stand by my opinion that he could be a good NFL C.
I got Tiger Blood running through my veins!
I don't expect immediate starter
Thats why I used the word PROJECT.
A Redskin Potato
by Mr PotatoHead on Jul 1, 2011 10:51 AM EDT up reply actions
It's a perfect word to use
just like Capers was last year. Maybe he’s ready to contribute in year two.
O’Dowd did play in a pro style system at USC. He was asked(a lot in his junior year) to pull from the C position, much like Pouncy did at Florida last year. O’Dowd did a very good job of this, and he does well getting to the second level to the LB’s. He needs to get a little stronger at the point of attack, as he tends to play too high, and he will have a little trouble with 330 lbs NT’s, but those problems can be corrected with good tech and improved strength.
I got Tiger Blood running through my veins!
you realize though that successful teams wouldn't draft a QB until their team was ready for them
And they also for the most part focus on defense and the offensive line.
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
This might be the dumbest statement you ever uttered
you realize though that successful teams wouldn’t draft a QB until their team was ready for them
You draft a QB, when you need a QB. If a good prospect is there, and you need a QB, you take him. Were the Falcons a good team when they drafted Matt Ryan?……………………no. He made them a good team. Were the Bears ready when they traded for Cutler?………………..no, their line sucked, and their WR were aweful. He made them contenders. Pitt’s offense was terrible before they drafted Big Ben……………now they are perennial contenders. The Ravens had a good defense, but a shitty offense when they took Flacco. Remember how he had no weapons around him?
Good QB’s make an poor team good. They raise the play of everyone around them. SEE SAM BRADFORD – no wr’s, rookie LT, overpaid/overdrafted RT, weak interior linemen. Rams almost made the playoffs in Bradfords rookie season.
I got Tiger Blood running through my veins!
seriously Tiller???
First off I never said anything about them needing to be a ‘good’ team, just ready for them.
Next your cases don’t make sense: The Falcons already had Roddy White, and Michael Jenkins (not worth a 1st rounder but not an awful option either) and went out and signed Michael Turner (which is a knock on your idea of signing big name guys). Along the O-line they already had a couple positions set in McClure, Clabo and Blalock. They also then traded up for Baker so we could draft 3 pass catchers in the 2nd round.
Did i miss when Cutler was so good in Chicago? The only reason that trade hasn’t been horrible for the Bears is that Josh McDaniels makes Vinny look like he’s Bill Walsh when it comes to drafting. Orton and Cutler have played basically the same, and the Bears could have 3 premium picks. If they had used those 1st rounders on a OT and a WR then maybe Chicago knocks off GB last year.
Steelers: Big ben had Plaxico, Hines Ward and Randle El to throw to, and Staley and Bettis to hand the ball off too (which isn’t great, but could be FAR worse). He also had a O-line with multiple All-Pro’s and Pro Bowlers on it. Don’t know how you say they were terrible.
Ravens did have skill talent, but their O-line was pretty good.
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
by Steve Shoup on Jul 1, 2011 9:32 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I just used a couple of examples
There are many more. Your reasoning was just plain stupid.
So, your trying to tell me that if Peyton Manning retired after this season, the Colts would go out and sign 1st and 2nd round O-Linemen, then bring in a bunch of FA vets, so the following yera they could draft their QB???? Just not logical bro.
Sorry, didn’t mean to insult you, but it was a pretty bad statement from a guy who knows the NFL pretty well.
And I’m sure the REC you got was from your 1/2 brother Parks, who has seemed to latch on to you like a 1 year old puppy the day before he goes in to get neutered.
I got Tiger Blood running through my veins!
I went Blalock.
Not the most expensive, but a definite upgrade.
No Danny, Nooooooo - Tom Landry, 1982., and Washington Redskins fans, 1999-
From the biggest Mankins supporter at HH. VIVA LA FLIP FLOP!
Editor at Hogs Haven - Redskins Blog
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
I would sign a value center like Satele from Oakland.
And leave our guards alone this season. See what Montgomery and Lichtensteiger have, and then address the position next year in the draft if need be.
In my opinion, the Skins should heavily target their 2nd rd pick next year on the best center, Mike Brewster, and consider a guard in round 3 or 4. Rabach will be gone, and Satele can be quality depth going forward.
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Recommended FanPosts
Recent FanPosts
In Association With
Shutdown Corner - NFL - Yahoo! Sports
- Detroit Lions DT Nick Fairley arrested again; now has more NFL arrests than NFL sacks
- Former high-school star Brian Banks does serious time on trumped-up charge, now hopes for an NFL shot
- Former ‘idiot kicker’ Mike Vanderjagt in trouble after accosting junior-high heckler
- Adrian Peterson blows teammates away in footraces; appears to be on the mend
- UPDATE: Charlie Sheen didn’t buy Lawrence Taylor’s Super Bowl ring
