17 Year Quarterback Shuffle
by Copious 1 on Mar 23, 2011 11:41 PM EDT
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PrintThere is an article in the Washington Times that all Redskins fans should read. It's painful, but good info.
Redskins’ quarterback shuffle adds up to lots of lossesRedskins’ quarterback shuffle adds up to lots of losses
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2011/mar/23/will-18-be-17-quarterbacks-in-17-chaotic-seasons-a/?utm_source=RSS_Feed&utm_medium=RSS
Highlights after the jump.
John Friesz, Heath Shuler, Gus Frerotte, Jeff Hostetler, Trent Green,Brad Johnson, Jeff George, Tony Banks, Shane Matthews, Danny Wuerffel, Patrick Ramsey, Tim Hasselbeck, Mark Brunell, Jason Campbell, Todd Collins, Donovan McNabb, Rex Grossman. (I don’t think I’ve forgotten anybody, but I may have repressed the memory of a couple.) Anyway, that’s 17 quarterbacks in 17 seasons, which goes a long way toward explaining why the franchise has won exactly two playoff games in that time - one against an 8-8 Lions team, the other against a Bucs club quarterbacked by Chris Simms.
So the quarterback procession has been a mixed bag of first-round busts (Shuler, Ramsey, Campbell), front-office brain freezes (George,Brunell, McNabb) and assorted other miscalculations and acts of desperation. It just underlines what football folk are always saying: There’s nothing more difficult than evaluating a QB, especially one coming out of college.
What's scary to me...after 17 seasons, there have only been 3 QB's drafted by the Redskins during that span. For more on the Redskins draft history: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Washington_Redskins_first-round_draft_picks
QB's we've passed on:
- Josh Freeman
- Aaron Rodgers
- Ben Rothlisberger
- Drew Brees
- Chad Pennington
- Kerry Collins
- Brett Farve
No 1st round pick in 2008, 2006, 2003, 1998, 1990
In the 17 year history we have had great OL, DL, LB, DB, RB, WR?, TE, but no QB. I would argue that WR is to be expected since we have had no QB to get any of the guys we've had the ball. I would also argue that 17 years without a QB would make that position our most pressing need above all else.
And for the RECORD. I'm not necessarily arguing that it can be address in this years draft; although I believe that it can be (probably Trying Smallett or Christian Blunder). My arguement is that out of all of the Redskins NEEDS, QB is #1.
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I’ll go ahead and say that the ‘Skins haven’t had a QB since Theismann. I know that two Super Bowls came after…but I mean really ask yourself, have we had a QB since Theismann?
The Once and Future King
Doug?
I come ready, when I came out the womb I was ready, tell them mama that's why you had me, you knew I was ready. -Moss
Beating your opposition physically is great and all, but confounding them mentally is sooo much more fun.
And to think
People on HH are fine with drafting another average QB in Ponder.
Are you not entertained?
We haven't drafted any average QBs.
We drafted a guy who was a total mistake (Shuler), a hard-luck kid that just was never quite going to make it (Ramsay) and a complete mismatch for every system we ran for him (Campbell). That being said, Ponder is an above-average QB in every single way except arm strength, where he is NFL average. You’ve never quantified what makes you think Ponder is “average” Tiller, nor have you even tried to explain what honestly makes Locker better in your mind besides arm strength.
Campbell was a perfect fit for Joe Gibbs original offense
Which we ran for one year, and then Danny (and others) convinced Joe Gibbs to hire Saunders
The world looks mighty different when you're peeking out your belly button
by Skins Fan '77 on Mar 24, 2011 1:13 PM EDT up reply actions
I still think Campbell got screwed by the revolving door that was your coaching staff...
but he was definitely not the answer.
"This is one of the top 10 biggest bonehead trades in the history of the NFL."
-Redskins TE Chris Cooley
by Ralf E Chubbs on Mar 24, 2011 2:07 PM EDT up reply actions
You think Ponder is the answer to our decade-upon-decade QB problems?
We have freakin went every route possible to find a QB, and all we have gotten is below average. What makes you think that a second round kid with a history of shoulder problems will be the miracle we’ve all been praying for?
I can list you many reasons(And I think I already have), why I believe Newton and Locker are better prospects. Shit, I would guess by now everyone on this damn board with the exception of you has already heard this speech.
What I would like to know is why YOU feel Ponder is better equiped to lead this team to a championship, and be our QB for the next decade over guys like Newton, Locker, Mallett and Gabbert.
Is it because you just don’t WANT to take a QB at #10, and feel Ponder is the least risky in the 2nd?
Are you not entertained?
Well, first of all,
because he’s not a second round kid lol. At this point I’m also doubting he lasts till 41. The only way I see us drafting Ponder is if we trade back in the first with New England and get their first pick in the second, which if I remember right is THE first pick in the second. Even then, he might go in the bottom of the first, though I’d be surprised if any of the teams picking after Seattle would use a first round pick on a QB (and it sounds more and more like Seattle will be trading for Kevin Kolb once the CBA is in place).
Anyhow, he can make every throw accurately, he’s got good size, great speed (.04 seconds slower in the 40 than Locker), great escapability and pocket presence (had the best shuttle time on FSU’s entire team), incredibly intelligent, a born leader, a high-character, humble guy, and the perfect guy to be the face of an organization. He absorbs playbooks quickly and competently, already understands how to read and manipulate defenses and is incredibly coachable for the things he needs work and experience with. His arm is back to 2009 strength, and the shoulder injury is behind him (by the way, one injury doesn’t make a “history of shoulder problems.”)
All that being said, to address your final sentence, absolutely not. You forget, I don’t want to draft a QB at all, unless it’s a 7th round or UDFA mystery pickup just to get them in camp for a 3rd string look-see. I want McNabb starting next season. Failing that, I can live with Grossman or another FA like Hasselbeck or someone similar for a year or two. BUT, if we do draft a QB, there’s no reason to do it in the first round with so many more glaring needs, and there’s no reason to spend a high draft pick on a guy with major character and mechanics issues (Newton), is a rooted tree (Mallett) or has been consistently inconsistent and inaccurate for his entire career. I’d probably take Gabbert over Ponder, but that’s it.
I'm not fine with it
The world looks mighty different when you're peeking out your belly button
by Skins Fan '77 on Mar 24, 2011 1:11 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Are you fine with it Parks
You pay good money to attend Redskins games. Are you ok with Ponder being the next face of our franchise?
Are you not entertained?
Sure, smart dude, hell of an athlete, and it means we addressed a more prudent need in the first.
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
SO SAYS TILLERDAMUS!
I don’t know where he’ll end up man, and I don’t know what spot we’ll be drafting at. I’ve said several times though, that I think SEVERAL of these QBs are going to be in the green rooms a lot longer then the experts think, it happens every year (Leinart, Quinn, McCoy, Clausen, etc.).
I think you kind of become obsessed with physical specimens and then tend to overlook guys like Ponder. I’d much rather focus on other things and have either Ponder, Devlin, or Dalton in burgundy and gold.
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
Devlin and Dalton?
You gotta be kidding me.
YOU have a better arm than Dalton
Are you not entertained?
No I don't, thats why I didn't play football at a big time school.
O and add Stanzi to my list…
YOU have a better arm than Dalton
This is my point exactly, you read into measurables WAY to much
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
This is my point exactly, you read into measurables WAY to much
I study these prospects. This is not some random guess by me. I watch, and I report what I see. I also know what to look for.
Are you not entertained?
Who did you watch more Mallett and Newton or Dalton and Devlin?
I haven’t seen any kind of detailed analysis on any of these guy, more big picture type things like measurables.
I want a guy with a good head on his shoulder more than anything else, Newton, Mallett, and probably Locker don’t fit that mold. Truth be told I don’t like any of the top QB prospects and I’m sure one or two will pan out, but I don’t want to take that risk right now. Develop a sharp kid and go from there, it wouldn’t come back to haunt us nearly as much as drafting a guy like Newton would.
If I had to put on my Tillerdamus hat the future would look kind of like this for these QBs from a big picture stand point, not how they look in one preseason:
Gabbert: Will be a productive QB, but not a star, kind of like a Schaub I guess…
Newton: Will show flashes of brilliance and excitement, kind of like VY, but will be a bust.
Mallett: BUST CITY, how do I insert a fart sound?
Locker: Has potential, and might work out. I hope he goes to a team like the Pats and can develop.
Ponder: Will do well in the NFL, it may take awhile like Brees, but he’s got the skills and he’s got the head.
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
This would be my board:
1.Blaine Gabbert
2.Jake Locker
3.Christian Ponder
4.Cameron Newton
5.Pat Devlin
6.Ricky Stanzi
7.Andy Dalton
8.Ryan Mallett
9.Nathan Enderle
10.Greg McElroy
11.Colin Kaepernick
12.Tyrod Taylor
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
5, 6, 7 are interchangeable in my mind.
I just really go to bed every night and pray that (S)Cam Newton will be off the board when we draft.
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
So are you against Gabbert or Locker at 14?
prob a stupid question to ask you.
Are you not entertained?
At 14?
I’m fine with either of those guys. I just don’t want Newton or Mallett within a 100 mile radius of Ashburn, VA.
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
I've watched Devlin since he was in high school
I watched 85% of Newton and Mallett’s games last season. I rarely saw Dalton play. I’ve been following Lockers career since he was a freshmen at UDub. I have seen Ponder play many times over the last few years.
If you want my personal opinion on Ponder, I don’t even think he was the best QB on FL St. I like Manuel better.
And yes, to an extent I am into measurables a little too much, only because I know how important they are in todays game. 20 years ago QB’s could get away with a lot more. Not so much these days with the athletes that are out on that field.
Are you not entertained?
And yes, to an extent I am into measurables a little too much, only because I know how important they are in todays game. 20 years ago QB’s could get away with a lot more. Not so much these days with the athletes that are out on that field.
35% of NFL Starting QBs beg to differ with you. Including the 2009 SB Champ.
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
You know every year the QB's
get bigger, stronger and faster. You won’t see too many more Drew Brees’ moving forward.
Are you not entertained?
I don't completely agree...
The average QB height from 1994 to 2008 was decreasing. We’ve reach a peak in the past two years with an influx of a lot of tall QBs. Its only natural for it to trend back down again.
The average QB height currently is within an half of an inch of what it was in 1982. And its about an inch higher from what it was in 1972. Weight wise its been in about the same 5 lbs range for about 20 years now.
So I don’t really expect to wake up tomorrow and see every QB being 6’7, 240, and running a 4 flat.
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
You're really bad at debating or conversating when facts come into play.
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
which is yet another crutch, haha
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
Guess what Tiller?
You finally said something about FSU that I agree with :)
If you want my personal opinion on Ponder, I don’t even think he was the best QB on FL St. I like Manuel better.
I do too. Given how much I like Ponder, that should tell you something. Manuel is going to be an absolute star in the next two years in college. We’ll have to wait and see how he progresses with reading defenses and managing the offense at the line to see about his NFL potential, but it’s looking good. 6’5", fast, strong, cannon arm … gonna be fun to watch :)
I can't believe we finally agree on something
we need to frame this thread(lol)
But seriously, maybe you’ll see that I really don’t have an agenda for or against any kid. I just try to call them like i see them.
Are you not entertained?
Ehhh I know that
I do think you probably zoned in on your opinions early and that makes it hard to change, but I don’t think you’re out to get Ponder or anything. I just think you’re wrong on him :-)
And
I would say smart, and a descent athlete.
Locker and Newton are “hell of an athlete” types. Ponder is not in that catagory.
So your left with smart, descent athlete, game manager, average accuracy, with below average NFL arm.
Are you not entertained?
Doesn’t sound too different from what Tom Brady was thought of when he was drafted in the 3rd round (3rd I think, right?).
what you've just said... is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.
by gopens44 on Mar 24, 2011 3:16 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Only off by 3 rounds. Not bad for my notoriously poor memory……. but nonetheless…..
what you've just said... is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.
by gopens44 on Mar 24, 2011 3:21 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Here is something else to consider
Of those 1st round QB’s taken, only Heath was a high first round pick. The others(Campbell, Ramsey) were much later in the first round.
We have an opportunity to take a QB at 10(assuming the right guy is avaliable). Or, should we risk it, and assume we will be even worse this season, and could possibly be picking in the top 5 in 2012. Only the two worst teams are going to have a shot at getting Andrew Luck in 2012. The Bengals atre going to blow this year. The Bills and Panthers are still going to suck. All three of these teams are likely going to be worse than us, and would take Luck in a heartbeat. Do we take a risk, and hope Landry Jones enters? I don’t like any of the other QB prospects 2012 has to offer.
Are you not entertained?
Brunell and McNabb were good QBs, but we got them
a little past their prime. I hate to think of earning a top 5 pick in 2012. That could get me following Marty’s Virginia Destroyers.
I'm OK passing on Chad Pennington and Cocktail Collins
I’m 100% sold there are no starting QBs in this draft….why force the pick. If you do, go ahead and add him to that top list of losers.
You could do this same article on the OLine and DLine too.
Hogs Haven. On Twitter. And Facebook.
Question Kevin....
In the past 17 years haven’t we had some top offensive and defensive lines? I don’t think the same argument can be made. Heck two years ago we had Haynesworth, Carter, Orakpo, and some other cat holding it down and everyone was cheering the greatness of the line, when Haynesworth felt like playing. Our offeinsive line did not reach this level of suck until what….3 years ago. Samuels, Kendall, Rabach, Randy, and Jansen were relatively solid.
That's fair
There’s a degree of suckiness that comes with head coach and offensive coordinator turnover that certainly makes things worse…plus not having a RB that is any threat to rush for over 20 yards at a time. I don’t have a lot of memories of Brunell getting scraped off the ground but maybe that’s b/c he threw a 3yard screen in the dirt to avoid it.
Hogs Haven. On Twitter. And Facebook.
by Kevin Ewoldt on Mar 24, 2011 12:48 PM EDT up reply actions
@ least Brunell has a record to his name, w/ the Redskins
22 straight completions!
"This is one of the top 10 biggest bonehead trades in the history of the NFL."
-Redskins TE Chris Cooley
by Ralf E Chubbs on Mar 24, 2011 2:10 PM EDT up reply actions
I think you forgot Kent Graham, Sage Rosenfels, and Rodney Peete
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
Edit made above....
And for the RECORD. I’m not necessarily arguing that it can be address in this years draft; although I believe that it can be (probably Trying Smallett or Christian Blunder). My arguement is that out of all of the Redskins NEEDS, QB is #1.
or Elizabeth Hasselbecks brother in law, Todd Husak, and Rich Gannon
I consider myself a one man wolfpack..@Diesel__44 on twitter.
We have had some of the worst QB play
over the last 2 decades of any team in the NFL.
The best we had was Brunell, and he was past his prime when we got him.
Are you not entertained?
only use a 1st round pick if the QB is really worth it
and it doesn’t look like there will be a QB worth it this year.
While I agree the highest need is QB I don’t see one worth drafting in the 1st round (or 2nd).
I don't understand
what more Cam Newton could have done for you people to make him “worth it”
If you think his character is a red flag, fine, but look at these numbers, and tell me he’s not a 1st round QB:
14 games played. 185 out of 280 pass attempts(66% completion percentage) for 2854 yards and 30 TD’s vs. only 7 int’s., with a QB rating of 182
He also averaged over 10 yards per completion, which shows he wasn’t just throwing short, dink-and-dunk passes.
NOW, if thats not enough, Newton also added 264 rushing attempts, for 1473 yards and 20 TD’s
Thats 50 total TD’s on the season.
He led his team to an undefeated season and a National Championship in THE HARDEST FOOTBALL CONFERENCE IN THE COUNTRY, THE SEC.
In the BCS National Chanpionship Game Newton was 20 of 34 passing, for 265 yards and 2 TD’s vs 1 INT. He also ran the ball 22 times for 64 yards.
Newton also won the Heisman(not like that matters)
He accomplished this in his first and only year starting at a D1 school
Now, are you seriously trying to tell me, based on his On-Field performance, that he’s not 1st round material?
Are you not entertained?
I don't like how the poll asks is QB "not" our most pressing need. Negatives need not be in poll questions, they can skew results due to confusion.
Anyway, our most pressing need is the same that it has been over the span this article covers- our OFFENSIVE LINE. If you look at our top three round draft picks over the past decade that were designated to the offensive line, you find Trent Williams and… I can’t think of another because Samuels and Jansen were over a decade ago now. O-Line has, and continues to be our most pressing need.
Some of the QB’s mentioned weren’t half-bad. Brad Johnson won a SB in Tampa (I know, defense right?); Brunell took the Jags to the conference title game, McNabb and Grossman (eek, just adding Sexy to the list for fun) each went to started in SB’s, and Trent Green had some very nice (offensively productive) years in Kansas City. Even Campbell didn’t look terrible this year.
The truth is, that any QB would look better than what we’ve had in recent history if the Redskins provided him O-LINE PROTECTION. If Mark “McCrap” Sanchez can can make back-to-back conference title games in this league, then I think that completely illustrates that except for a handful of elite QB’s, O-Line is what brings a QB success. That is our biggest are of need…
by preppiejack on Mar 24, 2011 4:07 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
These QB's you mentioned
as not being bad were not our QB’s. They were some other teams, who we picked up when they were past their prime.
Are you not entertained?
I think he stated that pretty clearly.
Green, Johnson, and Campbell, out of the 6 he listed, were not past their prime.
Brunell even succeeded as a Redskin b/c we were good in the trenches.
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
Brad Johnson won the SB AFTER playing for the Skins.
Trent Green’s biggest years in KC were AFTER playing for the Skins.
And even my Jason Campbell comment is obviously referring to AFTER playing for the Skins.
I think my list provided a mixed bag of players in and out of their prime. Heck, Grossman is probably not even over the hill now. Only Brunell and McNabb were over the hill, and Brunell (for an old guy) took us to the playoffs, and McNabb is just one year removed from the playoffs.
Johnson was banged up
and definitly past his prime when he was a Redskin. He was 31 when we got him. He did however have a good year in 1999.
Are you not entertained?
He was 17-10 and had the best year of his career in Washington.
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
Which was his only full season (a pro-bowl season at that) with the Redskins…
by preppiejack on Mar 24, 2011 4:32 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I would just like to draft a QB
and have be successful in DC for the next decade. Is that too much to ask for?
I’m sick of other teams cast-away’s
Are you not entertained?
I think the Texans wanted a franchise QB when they drafted David Carr...
Kid probably could have been decent too if they hadn’t destroyed his career by having no O-Line help. Why wouldn’t we solve the protection issue before we destroy a young QB’s career?
by preppiejack on Mar 24, 2011 4:34 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
And why are you saying Bingo
you just stated in a comment above that your OK with a 1st round qb.
Are you not entertained?
I'm ok with, in that I'm not going to flip out and break shit like I would if we drafted Newton.
You didn’t know I’m a proponent of building the trenches first?
OK, means mehhh… I’ll be ecstatic if we focus elsewhere, but I won’t be angry if we draft certain QBs.
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
Parks, I don't really know what your a proponent of
you confuse me more than I confuse myself
Are you not entertained?
So I haven't been preaching BUILD THE TRENCHES all year?
Come on Capt. Flip Flop put on your big boy thinking cap, don’t play dumb.
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
What is it about Locker that you guys are so impressed by??
Because it sure aint his performance on the field. He has more people making excuses for him than any player I’ve seen
I just have a feeling, from what I've seen, that he'll be a pretty decent NFL QB.
And I think Shanny can coach him up. Its definitely a risk, but what QB isn’t in this draft? If we go Dline-Oline in the 1st and 2nd then I’ll be jumping for joy, but if we draft a QB not named Newton or Mallett, I’ll be content and ok with it to see how it pans out.
That feeling I have, might just be gas though. I’d much rather recoop a third or fourth, so that we can build the lines and then have the luxury of going after a guy like Ponder, Dalton, Stanzi, or Devlin.
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
I understand "just have a feeling"
He is the kind of player that you want to be good & hope will be good but in reality he has not been that great. He had a chance to showcase his skills at the Senior Bowl & he played terribly. He has talent but his head does not seem to process what is going on, he had a lower wonderlic than Newton (20) & if you just look at how he plays I really don’t think he will make it in the NFL (even tho I also like him & I hope that he succeeds)
You gotta stop with the Senior Bowl
Thats not very compelling for your arguement.
Now, if your comparing Linemen, thats a different story.
Are you not entertained?
It's not a compelling argument when you are on the wrong side of it
for anyone else the Senior Bowl & the drills & practices leading up to it are another piece of the puzzle. His wonderlic for me is also a red flag, even bigger than his Senior Bowl fiasco. How someone who has been in the same college for four years & only scores a 20 is a mystery.
Drills and practices are a whole different stroy
Your referring to the game itself.
And, just out of curiosity, how did your boy Newton do on the Wonderlic?
Are you not entertained?
He had a 21
He’s been in a different college every year for the past three years, much different background than Locker & he still scored above him
McElory had a 42.
Let’s pick the smartest guy in the room and ignore talent.
I consider myself a one man wolfpack..@Diesel__44 on twitter.
So you're finally on the Locker train then?
Welcome aboard ENs.
I consider myself a one man wolfpack..@Diesel__44 on twitter.
Yea that is pretty pathetic...
I think that feeling may actually be gas.
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
Well ENs-
You did say take the dumbest guy who’s really talented..
But lemme axe you this- Between Locker and Ponder: Who has the higher ceiling?
I consider myself a one man wolfpack..@Diesel__44 on twitter.
That's a good question
& to be honest I have to say Locker. But IMHO Ponder will be the better QB of the two. I believe he will be very good but I also think that Locker does have the potential to be great
I like you Ens, you're straight up and stick to your guns
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
I nailed it then.
OutQ is the 10th preset.
I consider myself a one man wolfpack..@Diesel__44 on twitter.
No...but it's a good indication of general intelligence
& a 20 is pretty bad
by ENsDad27 on Mar 24, 2011 8:02 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
probably because the test isn't football related
I come ready, when I came out the womb I was ready, tell them mama that's why you had me, you knew I was ready. -Moss
Beating your opposition physically is great and all, but confounding them mentally is sooo much more fun.
just for that I hope and pray we draft Newton
I come ready, when I came out the womb I was ready, tell them mama that's why you had me, you knew I was ready. -Moss
Beating your opposition physically is great and all, but confounding them mentally is sooo much more fun.
We can
and we started that movement last year with Williams.
We’ll add some more pieces as we go, and a young QB can grow with his line.
Had we ignored OL last year, I wouldn’t even be arguing.
Are you not entertained?
Sweet...
We’ll add some more pieces as we go
Do you want more over-the-hill or injury prone O-Linemen because those are the only guys who don’t get re-signed and become free agents? Or did you want to trust a couple spots to some 6th rounders in the draft this year?
Had we ignored OL last year, I wouldn’t even be arguing.
We drafted ONE guy in the past decade… An offense uses FIVE LINEMEN and only ONE QB…
by preppiejack on Mar 24, 2011 5:19 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
There are actually some really good FA's
Joseph
Harris
Cole
Calabo
Nicks
Bushrod
To name a few. And, none of these guys are old
Then factor in some of the young guys we have on the team. Maybe add a second or third if we can manage to get one.
Are you not entertained?
Why would any of those guys want to come here.
And most likely at least 3 or 4 of those guys will re-sign.
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
Who knows
but thats a poor arguement if thats what your only reply is going to be
Are you not entertained?
How is the fact that 'the "free agents" won't be available because they will re-sign with their own team' a bad argument?
Peyton Manning is a free agent too. Let’s sign him rather than drafting a QB then.
by preppiejack on Mar 24, 2011 5:39 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
and I don't think thats exactly what Parks was trying to say
He’s looking at what would attract a top FA to DC over other potential suitors. And in this, I can sort of see his point, but again, it is all conjucture.
Are you not entertained?
This is a sports blog my friend
EVERYTHING we post here is conjecture
by ENsDad27 on Mar 24, 2011 5:57 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I'm just saying
Thats what Parks believes could be the case with some of these FA’s, but is there a way to actually prove it?
You say Locker is innacurate, and I say prove it. You point to his comp%, and I say OK, your right. This, we can’t prove
Are you not entertained?
Well explain to me why any of those guys would want to play here?
How is that a bad argument? I’m tired of overpaying for players.
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
I mean we're getting a RT either through Brown or Harris, I'm referring to interior young talent
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
by Parks Smith on Mar 24, 2011 10:44 PM EDT up reply actions
that netted us some big time talent last offseason
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
by Parks Smith on Mar 24, 2011 10:44 PM EDT up reply actions
?
You’re smart enough to know how bad the FA talent pool was last year. Under normal circumstances this would be the best in the last 5 years.
I consider myself a one man wolfpack..@Diesel__44 on twitter.
I'm also smart enough to know that a lot of players don't want to go to one of the most disfunctional franchises in the NFL
Do you not remember the players that marched through here last offseason and said “hmmm… No thanks!”
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
Which ones were those?
They brought players in and just because they let them leave w/o an offer or didn’t overpay as has been their history doesn’t mean they said "no thanks’.
I consider myself a one man wolfpack..@Diesel__44 on twitter.
They signed with other teams which would leave me to believe they did.
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
by Parks Smith on Mar 25, 2011 11:28 AM EDT up reply actions
Good to know that you wanted overpay and give longterm contracts to a bunch of 30+ players.
I consider myself a one man wolfpack..@Diesel__44 on twitter.
WHAT? Come on man be fair.
How am I advocating that at all? Did I say I wanted the guys that came through last year?
Your comment has nothing to do with the debate.
I just don’t think Shanny flashing his ancient rings is going to help us in FA, the same way putting out those three Lombardi wouldn’t help. We rival the Raiders for being the NFL’s poster boy of dysfunction, at this point why would someone volunteer to become part of that? We have to prove that we’re a functional franchise focused on winning before we become a destination for FA that want to win and help the club, not just guys looking to get paid and loaf.
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
by Parks Smith on Mar 25, 2011 11:41 AM EDT up reply actions
Why give 100%
When 30% will get you paid and laid. -Kenny Powers
I consider myself a one man wolfpack..@Diesel__44 on twitter.
For an in-his-prime free agent, money is 98% of the story
1% might be due to who the coach is
1% might be du to who the franchise is
"By far the worst performers on the team are in the front office." – Sally Jenkins
when jack kent cook died. patrick ramsey was our qb. he was not resigned because of JKC’s death- i forget the details but think its along the lines of the family not wanting to make a large, franchise setting decision before the “new” ownership took over. around that same time, the redskins scouting depart was disassembled and left in mass- many following charlie casserly to houston. we have never recovered. scouting and the inability to draft talent is currently the number 1 problem with this franchise. after 15 years, i dont know if the problem lies in the scouts or management not listening to their scouting dept. or an incapable owner forcing his way, butt until drafting is fixed- this franchise will range from sucks shit to maybe average.
A current example of traditionally sucky team making that change is the Bucs. Last year Tampa won a game starting 7 rookies and playing 12! They won 10 games and just missed the playoffs. They might not play in the NFC East, but they also lost 8 starters for the season by the first week of December- which would absolutely cripple us. The posts below says it all. My purpose is not to bash the skins and praise the bucs so much as point out that the give it 5 years to rebuild model is bullshit.
You dont have to wait and hope that in five years things will have changed. TB brought in a rookie head coach and rookie GM in 2009. The most interesting note is the GM came from the personnel dept- a former lead talent scout. He was not out of college or some “contract specialist.” (which is a joke anyways- you play with a salary cap and need to field a roster and balance the check book!). They went from 3 wins to 10 wins in their second year: 16 rookies, 19 undrafted players, 20 former practice squad players, 27 from waivers wire and 14 players drafted fifth round or later. Here’s hoping Shanallen can do half as well and give us something to root for.
http://www.bucsnation.com/2010/12/11/1870052/bucs-youth-and-bucs-links
by les boulez bomber on Mar 27, 2011 1:18 PM EDT reply actions
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