Out with the Old...
by BallHogsRadio on Feb 8, 2011 10:14 PM EST
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Print“Out with the old in with the new”. This is going to be the team motto for the 2011 offseason. After last years debacle I expected Shanahan to make some wholesale changes on both offense and defense. It appears I was right. So far there have been reports out of Redskins Park that Clinton Portis and Santana Moss will not be back with the team next year (well if there is a next year, looking at you Goddell).
I’m not sure there is one Redskin fan who is envisioning Clinton Portis in a Redskin jersey next year. While he had some very productive years here in DC, sometimes relationships run there course. Unfortunately this relationship ran its course about 2 years ago. He’s a a shell of his former self. Age and injuries have taken a major toll on Portis. The relative success of Ryan Torain and Keiland Williams all but sealed his fate in DC. Moss on the other hand comes as somewhat of a shock.
Santana Moss had a very productive 2010 campaign with 93 catches for 1115 yards and 6 TDs. He proved to be a reliable receiver for both McNabb and Grossman. However, Moss will be 32 by the time the season starts next year. His skill set is better suited for the slot position, but the success of the younger, and much cheaper, Anthony Armstrong appears to have made Moss expendable in the eyes of the Redskins. This should give Moss the opportunity to play the slot, his natural position, and play for a contender (Memo to Redskin fans: We are not going to be a contender next year).
While I imagine the Moss decision was a tough one I believe it was a necessary one. With Moss gone the Redskin can sign (or attempt to sign) a more prototypical #1 wideout. What is a prototypical #1 WR? Not sure, but I can tell you he’s bigger then 5’10” 209lbs. This offense is in dire need of a WR who is a viable Red Zone target. If I see one more corner fade to a sub 6 foot WR I’m going to throw myself into a piranha pit.
I think letting Moss go is only the beginning. I expect some other household names (i.e. Daniels, Rogers) to be on let go before training camp starts (whenever that is? F.U. CBA). The Redskins will have a new look next year. Frankly, it’s about time. For me it’s all about “out with the old, and in with the new”.
And no we can’t cut Daniel Snyder.
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So far there have been reports out of Redskins Park that Clinton Portis and Santana Moss will not be back with the team next year (well if there is a next year, looking at you Goddell).
There have? Where? All I’ve seen is speculation on Moss’s FA
I love how people can read a comment on here
And all of a sudden it’s “reports out of Redskins Park”.
Of course the CBA crap will play some part in all this, but right now all signs are pointing to no Moss or Portis
It is going to be one hell of a shitstorm when all these players who are slated to change teams via free agency and trade have to stay put because of the CBA situation.
A lot of players giving maximum effort…I’m sure.
by Ken Meringolo on Feb 9, 2011 9:11 AM EST up reply actions
Out the DOOR
I totally agree with that type of move …. game breaker 6’2" burner opposite Armstrong …
Well, there is at least one fan who thinks Clinton will be back -
me. He and Santana will lead the team. They need Moss – they only have two solid WRs, although I have hopes for Austin. I think Carlos will be back, too, but he has to chase the money – he needs it. I can’t see why Philip won’t come back, but he is old. We couldn’t get anything for him, so will be given a chance. Getting rid of good players according to some “youth” plan is just not a good idea. They should just build their team with the best players available, including when those best players are already on the team. You may like Torain more than CP, but that’s just one situation, not a new paradigm.
I feel like if Portis wants to play in the NFL then he has to sign with us at a discounted rate.
Look how many older RBs are available in the NFL and don’t get jobs or even training camp invites. LT could barely find a job last year and he may not this year.
I think Portis will sign here and can be a great 3rd down back.
Pretty much my thinking
Portis will be a Redskin, but at a low price. After all, he’s still one of the best blocking backs in the league, and even if we try to complete the line this year, we’ll still need help blocking for a year or two.
No Danny, Nooooooo - Tom Landry, 1982., and Washington Redskins fans, 1999-
by BillWard on Feb 9, 2011 6:44 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
You are kidding, right?
I think Portis will sign here and can be a great 3rd down back
I don’t recall a single 3rd and 1 he has made in the last 3 years. Granted 2 of those years were the famous Zorn Left behind the worst line ever. But seriously, Portis is done. No need to waste any more time with him. I bid him a fond farewell and good luck, though.
Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana.
third down back means blocker & pass catcher
it doesn’t mean short yardage back
"By far the worst performers on the team are in the front office." – Sally Jenkins
I want them both back
At low-end contracts heavily incentive-laden. That way, if they perform, they get paid. If they don’t, they don’t.
I'm not talking league minimum
but I’m also not talking $20 mil guaranteed.
I'm a little confused after reading this on HH in 2009.
The Skins have officially restructured Santana Moss’ contract, thus extending him through the 2013 season. I won’t pretend to understand the nuances of how the salary cap works, but the new deal alleviates the hit the team would’ve taken from the release of Jon Jansen. The contract also makes Moss’ money this season and next guaranteed by basically converting his salary to signing bonuses totaling $6.3 million.
All of this had Drew Rosenhaus tweeting up a storm today. This was written over the course of three consecutive tweets:
I’m glad we were able to restructure Santana’s deal. It was a win-win. More guaranteed $ for Santana and more cap room for the Redskins. […] Santana restructured his contract with the Redskins in order to guarantee and front load the next two seasons. This will also improve his … chances of getting a new contract extension after the 09 season. The Redskins are one of the best teams to work with – they want to win.
Things you do not want: Rosenhaus, the most notoriously greedy NFL agent, publicly expressing how much he loves working with you team. Basically, this means that your team is willing to meet Rosenhaus’ demands and (most likely) shell out excessive amounts of money for guys who are (more likely) aging veterans. But of course we already knew that about the Redskins. It doesn’t make Rosenhaus’ confirmation of it any less frustrating, though.
Having said that, this specific deal seems like a good one for the Skins. We’re certainly gonna need Moss over the next two seasons while either/both Devin Thomas and Malcolm Kelly develop into … something. After that, Moss’ money is guaranteed, we can cut ties if need be, take another cap hit, and start the cycle all over again.
It's voidable years.....
the Redskins essentially had to pick up the option by a certain date to retain him. Same with Asomughanfdfsfd.
Yet another offseason......another few months for the Skins to "shine".
I don't want them back
They’re part of the old mentality. We need a new mentality.
by killianskid34 on Feb 8, 2011 9:50 PM EST up reply actions
I never understand why people are worried about Snyder paying too much
It makes sense when there’s a cap situation to worry about, but… there’s no CBA, let alone a salary cap. The real decision (from a fan’s point of view) when it comes to guys like Moss, Portis, and Rogers is whether their contributions are worth taking away roster spots from younger players, who would have the opportunity to succeed in games and gain experience.
"DOWN GOES RODGERS!" -Brian Orakpo
My problem with snyder paying guys too much is it creates problems in the locker room and guys who think they are above the team.
Your highest paid player not only has to be your best player, but he also has to be your best person on the team. I believe this is similar to a quote from Ted Leonsis (can we just fast forward ten years to when he owns every franchise in Washington and we’re all winners?)
That said I have no problem with paying Santana 5 mil per year over the next 2-3 years, if he’ll take it, he’s a pro for sure and deserves every penny
by skinsfan28 on Feb 9, 2011 10:49 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I agree that that’s the problem with bringing in big-name free agents from other teams, and overpaying them. But I don’t think that rewarding an veteran player (and locker room leader) who’s been productive for your team would have a bad effect on the team’s chemistry. If anything, it would show the younger guys that if you work hard and contribute as a Redskin, you’ll be rewarded.
"DOWN GOES RODGERS!" -Brian Orakpo
I hope that day comes sooner rather than later
(can we just fast forward ten years to when he owns every franchise in Washington and we’re all winners?)
Dear Passionate fan, I know you are passionate, but please reply with a logical answer or I will ignore you.
by TerpsAllTheWay on Feb 9, 2011 5:05 PM EST up reply actions
exactly
Hogs Haven. On Twitter. And Facebook.
by Kevin Ewoldt on Feb 9, 2011 10:54 PM EST up reply actions
The Skins will need to greatly reduce the cost of many veterans to the team. It will be in lower cost contracts, trades, or cuts.
Go to http://www.redskins.com/team/ and it becomes apparent that in order to rebuild the Team many of the players that were productive in the past will need to go. Offense: Derrick Dockery, Mike Furrey, Stephon Heyer, Artis Hicks, Casey Rabach, Mike Sellers, and Roydell Williams. Defense: H.B. Blades, Phillip Buchanon, Andre Carter, and Vonnie Holliday. Some of these guy aren’t so old but an upgrade is needed for depth and productivity in the 3-4 defensive scheme. Only 11 players are listed here. A number of players at the Redskins site haven’t been tested and are part of the preseason 80 player limit. Quite a few will be cut come the August-September cut downs. Seven draft picks and a x number of free agents are yet to be added. Since there are currently about 75 players on the roster some will go in order to bring in the draft picks and free agents. It will take some radical roster changes to make this a competitive team.
Those cuts look pretty easy, although I hope they can keep Holliday
he’s a player and leader. The other defensive guys are all solid players, too, and would be missed. Surprising how much fat there is on the offense. All this suggests to me that money is not a problem – finding the right players, is.
If there are "Moss FA" rumors, its probably a negotiation tactic to lowball Moss new Redskins contract.
Teams would have to make really high offers to make Moss sell his house, say goodbye to his friends, take the kids out of school and move his family. He’s good, but is still a 5’10", 31y/o slot receiver.
The Redskins will make him a good (but not exorbitant) offer, and we’ll keep Moss in DC! Now, if only the Malcolm Kelly pick were to finally pay off! I still have hope he does.
5'10" 209 lb?
That sounds more like a running back to me, he does get his fair share of YAC yards. Move him to the slot and then the Redskins will need a big FA WR if there are any available.
I heard the Redskins covet Sidney Rice, but it sounds like the Vikings will transition tag him (?) and then the Redskins would have to throw stupid money at him (so it might happen!).
Curious as to where you hears this
I heard the Redskins covet Sidney Rice,
I think this would be a great get
Are you not entertained?
Agreed he has only ONE 1000 YD season in his 4 seasons.
His second highest total is 396 YDs. Lots of people around here sure do miss Vinny..
I consider myself a one man wolfpack..
better than our injury prone WR that averages 0 yds per game
cough…Malcolm Kelly…cough
by Ken Meringolo on Feb 9, 2011 9:05 AM EST up reply actions
rice
is a big dude and a playmaker. i think it would cost too much to get him though.
by vjessejamesv on Feb 9, 2011 9:01 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
I think I actually should have said
I heard the Redskins covet a player like Sidney Rice
What pick are you guys willing to give up for Sid Rice?
He’s a RFA.
I consider myself a one man wolfpack..
Unde the old agreement yes
but that ends March 4th. And the only reason he was a RFA was because of that 5th year clause that the uncapped season brought. I don’t think a new CBA, if these is one reached before march 4th, with require a 5th year of service to become a FA. It will likely drop back to 4.
Are you not entertained?
Bring in the New
I agree we can afford to drop Portis I’m comfortable with what I saw out of Torain and Williams the last 4 games. Moss realistically isn’t going to get a long term deal but the Skins need a plan to compensate his production maybe through the draft or the team maybe have what they want already on the roster.
I don't believe any rookie WR can replace the production Moss has provided
When was the last time a rookie WR had 93 catches and over 1100 yards?
It’s stupid to cut someone when you don’t have a replacement lined up.
by aFan4Life on Feb 9, 2011 8:10 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
I'm not sure where you're hearing Moss is gone from
Everything I’ve heard said Moss is frustrated with losing, but wants to stay and win with the Redskins. I thought he made it clear just a couple weeks ago when he stated he wanted to retire as a Redskin.
Considering, he’s STILL the best WR on the team, he’s STILL productive and has another 3-5 GOOD years left, the market is pretty well saturated with similar prospects (removing incentive for him to move, but not really helping us, either, since they don’t know Shannahan’s system, don’t know the other players, and have an unknown future if they come to the team (performancewise). Some may be better, yes, but they could also be FA busts. When you are already weak in a position, you don’t throw away the best you have, you get something to bolster what you have. Jettisoning Moss for not one but TWO new FA or Rookie WR (and yes, I’m discounting Kelly) you would need to be your #1 and #2 sets you back more than just a rebuilding. AA is a fine WR, but he should be the #3. Moss should be the #2…. and it’s easier to find ONE #1 than a #1 and a #2 in one season.
So no, I think Moss is going to be a Redskin for the next 3-5 years, to be honest.
Oh, and I’m still of the opinion that Portis will be back, if he wants to be, and cheaply. And I think he wants to be; you could see the frustration with the injuries last season, and the fact that Shannahan didn’t IR him after the first, and was so anxious to get him back proves Shannahan still thinks he’s got gas in the tank… and that blocking ability could be a lifesaver for a young QB that we might pick up.
No Danny, Nooooooo - Tom Landry, 1982., and Washington Redskins fans, 1999-
I hope snyder is snyder this offseason
This is one of the few years that I want snyder to be snyder. With free agents available like Lamar Woodley, Asomaugh (spell check), and many others, I hope snyder brings out the check book.
Now sure we will say that this is stereotypical redskins, trying to buy a championship. With this free agency class…I say go for it.
Victory
Snyder is probably willing to be Snyder, but I hope Allen can suppress his frugal
instincts, go a little crazy, and get us some talent. Dan won’t mind – he wants to win.
There's an equation here
You can’t “bring in the new” if there’s no new to bring in. Our draft options are limited and even though the FA class is big, they have to identify replacements that are signable. And FAs aren’t necessarily going to be spring chickens.
I have enough respect for Shanahan to assume that if he lets someone go, he’s got a plan to replace them with equal or better. We have a story to tell on Portis, but has this WR group or do the FAs out there really suggest that there’s a good alternative to Moss in the slot?
That is the issue
’Tana is a great slot threat but just an average #1. Anthony is good as a #2 given his elusive speed, a lot less wear and tear and his contract costst less. We need a real #1. A big guy with some speed. you know the guy you need to double team all the damn time. Either through the draft or FA.
Letting santana go will free up some money to do that
Armstrong made Moss expendable?
Please tell me nobody in Redskins Park is that delusional.
Armstrong is a great find. Has upside (!) and speed. But the ways in which he’s NOT a replacement for Moss are myriad.
"By far the worst performers on the team are in the front office." – Sally Jenkins
+1
Dear Passionate fan, I know you are passionate, but please reply with a logical answer or I will ignore you.
by TerpsAllTheWay on Feb 9, 2011 9:38 AM EST up reply actions
+50
this is one of my main frustrations as a Skins fan
a player (Torain) for example as a couple of League average, or just above league average games and suddenly he is the answer to all our prayers, and i will readily admit I was guilty of this with Fred Davis at the end of 09.
We need to stop comparing Redskins to Redskins and start comparing them to other teams players at that postion, then you see what a terrible, woeful, just plain awful position our current roster is in.
Again, I will say it, we need to commit to a 3 or 4 year rebuilding program
Pommylee
even 1-2 FULL drafts would do it
couple first round prospects, couple 2nd round prospects, could later round gems for depth or surprise stars
with GOOD drafting you can do it in a pretty short amount of time
"By far the worst performers on the team are in the front office." – Sally Jenkins
U could be right
Tampa this year showed that if you get lucky with a few late round picks, it can be done quicker than you realise.
Tho that division is just B—R-U-T-A-L BRUTAL right now so I could easily see them slip to 6-10 next year. But the thing is even if they do, they are a 6-10 team that is young and has direction. I’d rather be a young 6-10 than an old 8-8
Pommylee
what about 4-12? and 5-11?
god this team has been worthless so often.
"By far the worst performers on the team are in the front office." – Sally Jenkins
new receiver, new jersey, new sales, dumb move
by les boulez bomber on Feb 9, 2011 6:34 PM EST reply actions
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