Ten Yard Fight: How Many of These Bold Moves Should the Redskins Consider?
by Ken Meringolo on Dec 13, 2011 12:49 PM EST
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PrintFull disclosure: I am not advocating that the Redskins do all of these things. Some of these moves are not even going to seem that bold to many of you. With three important tests remaining for our young team this season, I am optimistic some of these points will be rendered moot. I can just feel the fire from some of you on a couple of these, but here goes:
1. Draft a left tackle -- I think Trent Williams is coming along just fine in his career. He is still learning, but has already shown signs that he can be an impact performer on our line. Unfortunately, that learning process is currently on hiatus. I am not suggesting we draft a replacement for a guy we just burned a fourth overall pick on in a recent draft. I am suggesting we draft another blue-chip tackle prospect capable of playing left tackle in the NFL. Nothing we hope to do is possible without quality bookend tackles. That includes grooming a young quarterback behind a strong running game. Let the rookie tackle and TW battle it out over which side works best for each player in training camp. Better that we have two guys capable of covering the blind side--especially since only God knows which hand our future quarterback will be using to throw the ball. This is not to suggest that we don't have or can't develop one of the young guys to turn into quality contributors. But there is a reason guys like Joe Thomas, Jake Long and even D'Brickashaw Ferguson go at the top of drafts. Our offensive line needs another rookie blue-chipper.
2. Bring in a stud tight end-- I am struggling to think of a team dumb enough to let one of these new-fangled freaks of nature test the free agent market. You almost have to go to the draft to get your 6'6" 260+ lb athlete to fill out your tight end corps. Those are Jimmy Graham's measurements and he was a 3rd round pick in 2010. As you all know, I bang the multiple tight end drum pretty loudly around here and I am not afraid to use a 3rd round selection on a player like this next April. On one hand, we should be able to make Chris Cooley and Fred Davis work. On the other hand, we simply have not really seemed to make that a priority. When I recently spoke to Chris Cooley, he lamented the way that the Redskins have yet to really find a way to get a two-tight end system up and running at a high level. And when you layer in the fact that we have been forced to roll without either Fred Davis or Chris Cooley (or both) for stretches over the last few seasons, I could think of worse investments to make in our offense.
3. Trade LaRon Landry on draft day-- I can hear some of you asking, "How do you expect to have enough picks on draft day to make some of these moves?" This would be my response. You hate to ship out a player of his caliber, but if Mike Shanahan is serious about significantly upgrading his offense, this decision might have to be made. If Bruce Allen can find a team that still sees the Defensive MVP candidate from the first half of last season, I would favor making the trade. As we all know, LaRon is an unrestricted free agent this offseason, so it is not as simple as moving a guy under contract. We would have to put the franchise tag on him and then negotiate down from the unrealistic asking price that would traditionally accompany a player wearing the franchise tag. I do think Landry can still play--at a high level. I hope one or two NFL teams agree with me, because Landry's greatest value to the Redskins is likely to be in the form of whatever draft picks we can get in return for him.
4. Starting wide receivers in 2012: Reggie Wayne, Santana Moss, Niles Paul and Leonard Hankerson-- I don't see us being able to burn a top draft pick at this position, especially given we have two rookies right now who are likely to factor heavily on our roster for the foreseeable future. I spent a considerable amount of time watching Niles Paul on Sunday and I have to tell you all that he is very impressive. On special teams, I watched him circle around behind a return play and come back to make the tackle in pursuit. You have to go back to preseason to remember significant stretches where Paul was a continuous target in the passing game. I think he has a very bright future as a receiver on this team. I have downgraded my position on Hankerson from "Bieber Fever" to "Just Please Be Better than Westbrook." I think Hank the Tank will factor in our red zone attack, but the truth is we just have to wait and see. Adding Reggie Wayne as a #1 receiver for us would have a very positive impact on Santana Moss. Not only were they teammates at "The U," Wayne could allow Moss to move permanently to the slot without drawing the other team's attention on every single play. Also, if you are going to be serious about two tight ends, you could do a lot worse than Reggie Wayne and Santana Moss on the outside keeping defensive secondaries honest.
5. The inevitable "Tough Decision" on Mike Sellers-- I hate this one. I feel compelled to include it because entering a season without Mike Sellers would be bold indeed. I think he falls into the category of "you need to have guys like him on our team" but at some point coaches have to weigh very carefully the impact he makes both on and off the field. Since I am advocating bringing in another stud tight end to add to the mix, I am forced to make room for him. You have to hope that guys like Lorenzo Alexander and yes, even Niles Paul can spread their wings on special teams as leaders to fill the void that will be left when Big Mike is gone.
6. Dip toes in the Drew Brees waters-- I don't believe for one second that New Orleans will ever let Drew Brees end up in a position where he is able to take calls and/or field offers from other teams. I am also firmly in favor of drafting the next quarterback of our team and letting Rex Grossman take all the snaps until the rookie is ready. HOWEVER, if Drew Brees somehow does make it to the market, we simply must kick those tires. I hate the idea of adding Peyton Manning--even if we do end up with Reggie Wayne. How many $100 million contracts can a guy sign with a broken neck? As for Brees, how could we fault Bruce Allen and Mike Shanahan for breaking the bank to sign a guy who completes damn near 70% of his passes for well over 300 yards per game? He is a proven leader in the league and he adds instant credibility to an offense. At the very least, pursuing Brees with a big contract will not only push the Saints to pay dearly to keep him, it could make us look good even if we don't sign him. Anyone who signs Brees is smart. So attempting to sign him has to be also viewed as smart, right? I'll take it. The Redskins are not often associated with "smart"...though that could be changing!
7. Bring in a new returner -- Brandon Banks is a talented player with unquestioned agility and escapability. The thing is, you can get a guy with the same amount of athleticism and speed these days that has a lot more size than Banks. Brandon is not going to break a lot of tackles, and it seems most of his returns are terminated in...well...tackles. Perhaps Niles Paul is the guy who can add the physical aspect that Banks does not possess. Perhaps we need to target a big, physical cornerback in the draft who comes with this skillset. As much as I have enjoyed the breathless moments as a fan while the ball is in the air and visions of Banks taking it to the house danced in my head, it just seems like we need to score on special teams to win games. If Banks goes a whole season without scoring, then I would seriously consider giving another guy an opportunity.
8. Hire a new Special Teams Coordinator -- Danny Smith is an institution on our sideline, and I don't think he necessarily deserves to be fired. As I have said before, he is a very good coach and would not be unemployed long if we let him go. But if you are playing the home version of Ten Yard Fight today, you are seeing a little bit of a theme. If we go into 2012 without Danny Smith, Mike Sellers and Brandon Banks (Graham Gano?) we would be looking at a brand new special teams mojo. We can debate over how necessary it is to COMPLETELY overhaul the special teams unit, but a change here could end up doing our team a lot of good. We need a spark, and special teams is the place where you are forever hopeful to find that spark.
9. Take out more seats at FedEx -- Hahaha...I have been chewing on this one for a while. If Dan Snyder is trying to find the magic number of seats that results in an actual home-field advantage, that magic number is further south of the current capacity. I still believe he is bent on putting some kind of roof over the stadium so he can get his Super Bowl, and less seats won't exactly bolster that bid. But I also believe that the Redskins have a real problem selling tickets--especially to Redskins fans. It is conceivable that they could downsize the stadium again and still not be able to field a burgundy and gold majority. I know a lot of people who read this are not currently in the D.C. area, so this one might not mean as much, but for people who go every week, it is getting rather old wondering which team just did something good based on the crowd reaction. And no...I don't think this is a problem experienced by most teams in the NFL. Hell, I have been to Ravens home games and it is the exact opposite. If I was the owner of the team, this issue would be on my list of things to actively work on.
10. Re-invent Brian Orakpo-- Despite how this sounds, Orakpo is not having a bad year. He is still very much an impact player on our defense. I am just wondering if there is a way to do a better job of featuring him on our defense. Some of you out there know x's and o's a lot better than I do, but it seems to me that we could working harder to put #98 in better positions to influence the game. Maybe this question is best answered by UKRedskin? I would be interested in seeing how effective Orakpo may have been when we lined him up behind Kerrigan as opposed to putting him one-on-one against an offensive tackle. Have we even blitzed him a lot in that fashion? Am I over thinking this? Or is this just a dumb idea? Don't act like you have never told me I am an idiot!
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Orakpo
I agree we need to move Orakpo around, but he needs to develop some alternative than the speed/bull rush. He is easy to defend because he only has those. Look at Clay Matthews for example. He has many different moves and tends to get to the QB whenever possible. But, he is also a better pass defender too. Maybe the solution is to stop thinking that Orakpo is an OLB and make him a DE only.
by Ryan McQueeney on Dec 13, 2011 12:59 PM EST reply actions
Why would Redskins take out more seats when there’s a waiting list full of ticket brokers?
"You know those balls that they put on car antennas so you can find them in the parking lot? Those should be on every car!" - Homer Simpson
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Why would the Redskins take out more seats...
when they should just demolish that dumb stadium or rename themselves “the middle of nowhere Maryland Redskins”
I like
The RalJohn Redskins
Where do they teach you to talk like this? In some Panama City "Sailor wanna hump-hump" bar, or is it getaway day and your last shot at his whiskey? Sell crazy someplace else, we're all stocked up here.
I wish he would bring back the larger seats. When he first became owner he ripped out the old seats and replaced them with smaller seats, just to increase capacity. Now he’s ripping seats out? Snyder thinks we forget this stuff….
My give a damn broke.
by davesomethin on Dec 13, 2011 5:21 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Where?
Editor at Hogs Haven - Redskins Blog
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"As I have said before, he is a very good coach and would not be unemployed long if we let him go.'
How do you know he is a very good coach? Judging by our special team units over the years I suggest the opposite
We are always good in coverage. Those are because of his schemes
Duck Fallas!!
by believe_the_curse on Dec 13, 2011 1:12 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
we were good in coverage last year
the years before that we sucked ass…this year its hard to judge because of the new rule. Our special team units as a whole suck though…explain the block kicks in Seattle
bad coaching
Belicheck has WRs playing defense for him right now…that is a sign of good coaching
You do know they have one of the worst defenses right haha
Duck Fallas!!
by believe_the_curse on Dec 13, 2011 1:20 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Well there ya have it
Where do they teach you to talk like this? In some Panama City "Sailor wanna hump-hump" bar, or is it getaway day and your last shot at his whiskey? Sell crazy someplace else, we're all stocked up here.
okay but TW was out for a number of weeks earlier so it wasn't like there wasn't an experienced back-up option
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
Well for one the dude who blocked them is a beast
And the makeshift line we have. Also I don’t know if it’s that big of a factor but playing in seattle
Duck Fallas!!
by believe_the_curse on Dec 13, 2011 1:18 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
When’s the last punt or kickoff TD we gave up? I can’t remember one in Zorn or Gibbs era.
"You know those balls that they put on car antennas so you can find them in the parking lot? Those should be on every car!" - Homer Simpson
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by Kevin Ewoldt on Dec 13, 2011 1:29 PM EST up reply actions
I think it was desean Jackson a couple years ago
But still
Duck Fallas!!
by believe_the_curse on Dec 13, 2011 1:30 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Deseaon Jackson and Reggie Bush, I believe in the same season 08 or 09 maybe?
"Were not here for a long time... were here for a good time."
We don't give up a lot on coverage as has been suggested...we seldom give up big plays
by Ken Meringolo on Dec 13, 2011 1:30 PM EST up reply actions
We seldom make them either
Editor at Hogs Haven - Redskins Blog
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1. We should definitely draft a tackle. Either left and move Trent or right and cut Brown
2. We don’t need a TE. That’s #753 on our list of needs
3. Who would trade for Landry?
4. Reggie Wayne is a nice option but i like the kid out of NY, Devon Thomas. I hear he is a gamer
5. There is no decision on Sellers. He’s gone. Only on this team does an overrated special teams player become a star. Lorenzo Alexander i’m looking at you too.
6. Drew Brees isn’t going anywhere and is going to be expansion for the Saints
7. Banks is fine but we should give him some competition
8. Danny Smith will be giving Sellers a ride because they are both as good as gone
9. To improve the stadium experience we don’t need less seats we just need more wins.
10. Jenkins will be on the same side as Orakpo and that will help. Sorry but our current D line doesn’t scare anybody
UVA and Virginia Tech students have a lot in common. We were all accepted to Virginia Tech.
I keep forgeting about Jenkins
I thought they were going to rotate the line heavily this year, Jenkins at left then NT then right same for coefield and bowwen
Counting cards isn't illegal. It's frowned upon, like masturbating on an airplane.
I hope he comes back 100%
I can still see the look of devastation on Shanny’s face when the trainer came off the field and spoke told him it was an ACL injury. I think he was a much bigger loss than we realize.
by TheSportsManager on Dec 14, 2011 11:47 AM EST up reply actions
kerrigan
i think the lack of creativity with scheming plays for orakpo is somewhat due to the fact that ryan kerrigan is a rookie….in one interview with haslett, he discussed how they didn’t want to over burden kerrigan, so they’ve been keeping them on their respective sides, but that as the season progressed they’ve switched them up a bit more
As for me, all I know is that I know nothing.
*Socrates*
"entering a season without Mike Sellers would be bold indeed"
Cmon we are talking about a fullback here…not that big of a deal to let him go right now…he sucks anyway
yep
Sellers is 100% gone after this year. Kenny is pulling his own heart strings.
"You know those balls that they put on car antennas so you can find them in the parking lot? Those should be on every car!" - Homer Simpson
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by Kevin Ewoldt on Dec 13, 2011 1:29 PM EST up reply actions
I can't believe he's made it this long
Editor at Hogs Haven - Redskins Blog
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Did sellers even come in for Young when him missed time? Perhaps Sellers had additional value this year because of his work at TE and the impending issues with Cooley and Davis.
by TheSportsManager on Dec 14, 2011 11:57 AM EST up reply actions
We should make the FB position relevant again
not Kuhn relevant, but a good SURPRISE reciever out of the backfield can do some damage..
young has what 4 catches this year?
I think we need to do it more
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
Is this a parody?
(1) I don’t disagree with the need for an OT, but it’s more so the team can dump Jammal Brown. And if you’re going to get a blue chip OT, you’re not going to draft a QB. Which do you think is a bigger need? PS: you’re not getting a blue chip OT with a draft pick acquired for Laron Landry.
(2) go hunting for a player at one of the few positions at which the team actually has some talented depth.
(3) I’m not sure that Landry is worth more to another team than he is to the Redskins. His injury history is scary for everyone, but ours is the only defense that he already knows how to play.
(4) No Reggie Wayne, please. Haven’t this team done enough paying exhorbitant prices to aging players under the mistaken assumption that they can/will do that in DC?
(5) It’s hard to call any move involving Mike Sellers a “bold move.”
(6) Drew Brees? Really? Drew Brees? That’s like saying the Redskins should consider hiring Patrick Willis if he becomes available, because he’s a pretty good LB.
(7) If you have two players (Banks and Paul) that can do a job, why get more?
(8) I actually think that Smith is a pretty good ST coach; and certainly I think that special teams are WAY down the list of team needs. By most measures (average returns, opponent field position, etc) the punting, punt coverage and kick coverage units are good to very good. The return game is average (kickoffs) to slightly better than average (punts).
(9) I have no real comment here.
(10) Don’t mess with Orakpo, he’s not the problem either.
you realize that Banks can't do the job right?? He's among the leagues worst return men
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
Why would Landry sign here if we are going to trade him?
Furthermore, why would a team trade for Landry when they can get him in free agency?
Editor at Hogs Haven - Redskins Blog
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Re-read the paragraph.
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by Kevin Ewoldt on Dec 13, 2011 1:30 PM EST up reply actions
I did read it, there is more probability of me farting a rainbow out of my butt this afternoon then that scenario.
Why would a player willingly renegotiate if they are getting franchise tag money? That’s insane.
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If we franchise him and then trade him, his incentive to put a long-term contract in place with the new team is that he gets more guaranteed money
by Ken Meringolo on Dec 13, 2011 1:37 PM EST up reply actions
How so?
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by Parks Smith on Dec 13, 2011 1:45 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
not necessarily the Franchise tag might be only a one year guarantee, but my guess is the tag number is around $9 million
Sure Landry might be able to sign a 4-5 year deal with the guaranteed money at $12-13 million, but in no single year would he get anything close to $9 million. For him the smarter move would be to take the $9 million next year, and try to play his way for a bigger contract with a healthy productive season.
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
by Steve Shoup on Dec 13, 2011 2:17 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Right...which he has been unable to do for a while...hahaha
you have to take the bigger piece of pie.
by Ken Meringolo on Dec 13, 2011 2:26 PM EST up reply actions
The bigger piece of the pie is accepting the franchise tag..
You’re presenting the large piece of the pie versus and old, stale crappy pie
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yeah from Landry's perspective one year at $9 million is better than settling for just $12 million guaranteed over 4-5 years
if Landry is even remotely healthy he’ll get a bigger contract in 2013, and that combined with the $9 million will far exceed what he’s getting now. Also, by accepting the Franchise tag offer, if the Skins want to use it again in 2013 they have to pay him 120% of his previous deal (so nearly $11 million). If I’m his agent I’d tell him to sign his name on the dotted line the day the Redskins tagged him (wouldn’t even try to negotiate a deal), as he would only lose leverage otherwise.
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
no not at all I think tagging him is the worst move they can make
b/c if they do I think he’ll sign right away, and if he has another bad/injury filled year the Redskins are paying him a premium and eating up valuable cap space. And if he has a great year, his price tag in 2013 will be huge, and he’ll have a great year in a season that likely won’t be a competitive year.
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
But if he signs that deal and gets hurt or has a bad season
thats almost a nail in the coffin for him. He’d rather take 35mil over 6 years I think than 9 over 1
Counting cards isn't illegal. It's frowned upon, like masturbating on an airplane.
Where is 35 over 6 years coming from?
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just throwing out something like Bowen and Coefield got
Thats a middle of the road contract. For a middle of the road player
Counting cards isn't illegal. It's frowned upon, like masturbating on an airplane.
You're not paying attention, the key word is "guaranteed"
Remember when McNabb signed a 3 gazillion dollar deal with the Redskins a year ago? How much of that did he see.
The 9 mil from the franchise tag is guaranteed.
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I know that.
But you have to look at it from a angle where you want constant revenue. If he gets that 9 million but gets hurt or shows that half of last year was a fluke, theres no way he gets a bigger contract. If it were me I’d take a 5-7 year deal with 25-35million guaranteed (thats not unreasonable for landry) with incentives to make as much as X amount (whatever the skins are willing to pay for him)
Counting cards isn't illegal. It's frowned upon, like masturbating on an airplane.
Their point was:
It would make much more sense for LaRon to take $9 million guaranteed for one year rather than $10-12 million guaranteed over 4 or 5 years
but he'd never get that money, the guaranteed amount on even a deal like that would be what maybe $15-17 million
so if he gets injured he’ll never come close to $35 million
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
I'm just saying what I would personally do. Former players have even spoke about being franchise tagged
they don’t like it. Yeah it gets them a chance to make good money, but if they don’t preform well or get hurt, there pretty screwed after that year.
Counting cards isn't illegal. It's frowned upon, like masturbating on an airplane.
How so? They are getting about 80% of the money in one year then they would of gotten in a 3-4 year deal?
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Ok hey Parks you can make 120K dollars next year
Or
would you prefer 340K over 4 years
Or 500K over 7
and if you don’t do your job good next year, you’ll only make 32K a year for the rest of your career.
Counting cards isn't illegal. It's frowned upon, like masturbating on an airplane.
You're missing the point, the 500K or 340K IS NOT GUARANTEED
The 120K is. Therefore I’d take the 120k and take my chances
Editor at Hogs Haven - Redskins Blog
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did Coefield and Bowen not get 25 million guaranteed?
Counting cards isn't illegal. It's frowned upon, like masturbating on an airplane.
Ok i was mistaken i thought they got that guaranteed
Anyways to me landry is worth 35Mil over 6 years guaranteed with incentives up to 60, he could make as much as 10 mil a year. Which he probably wont because all those incentives should be for getting interceptions.
Counting cards isn't illegal. It's frowned upon, like masturbating on an airplane.
that would be a horrible deal for the Skins
Landry would be lucky to get $15 million guaranteed, much less $35 million
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
by Steve Shoup on Dec 13, 2011 2:59 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
dear god...
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he'd make just over 5mil a year....
and with the rookie wage scale were not going to get a 40million rookie deal this year, it’ll be reasonable.
Counting cards isn't illegal. It's frowned upon, like masturbating on an airplane.
at this point I'd offer him Stephen Bowen money and say take it or leave it
5 years $27.5 million, $12.5 guaranteed.
Of that guaranteed money I’d have $7.5 million in signing bonus money, and the rest of it in the first two years. That way if he is injured the Redskins can cut him after 2 years and not eat a ton of money. I’m going to do a fanpost about how it would all work later.
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
he's making nearly 4 million this year anyways
http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/washington-redskins/laron-landry/
I think landry walks for anything under 3 a year.
Counting cards isn't illegal. It's frowned upon, like masturbating on an airplane.
Well right now he is playing under a contract signed as the 6th overall pick in the old rookie wage scale.
Due to his play, I would expect him to be paid less than what he currently makes
Landry's actually making $5.2 million this year
http://www.thewarpath.net/WarpathRedskinsCap.htm
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
A piece? No they absolutely didn't
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Combined they did, but they only got $12.5 guaranteed a piece
which is the guarantee that Landry could expect.
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
but he wouldn't get $340K over 4 years or 500K over 7, not if you are supposing he gets injured
it is do you want 120K this year, or 160K over 4 year with the chance to make 340K, and if you don’t get injured next year, you can get 120K next year, plus 250K over the next 4 years with the chance to earn 600K over that time.
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
by Steve Shoup on Dec 13, 2011 2:56 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
yes but those are players who would make more on the open market
Landry won’t necessarily do that. Sure a Haloti Ngata might not have liked getting Franchised, but that is b/c he was going to get Haynesworth money on the open market. Landy won’t get Weddle or Polumalu money, hell he won’t even get Antrell Rolle money on the open market.
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
but we can still trade him regardless of all of this is my point
whether he signs or not, using the tag allows us to market him.
Am I missing what you and Parks are getting at? I could care less what Landry does when the tag is used. The only way we can trade him is by using the tag is all I was trying to say.
by Ken Meringolo on Dec 13, 2011 2:36 PM EST up reply actions
could we trade him yes, but some team wouldn't want to deal for him if they expect him to just sign the Franchise tag deal
and if he signs that deal right away (like he probably should from the players perspective) it would further diminish his trade value. The only way a team would deal for him is if they are sure 100% that he’d agree to restructure his deal (i.e. McNabb), which gives Landry a ton of leverage.
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
no disagreement there
I guess we disagree on whether or not he would sign the tag right away. I still think he would agree to a long-term deal with somebody for a few more bones rather than take a one year deal.
by Ken Meringolo on Dec 13, 2011 4:24 PM EST up reply actions
I mean maybe he is so arrogant to thinks that he deserves more
but i’d have to imagine any agent would advise him to sign it. The only exception would be if doctors were telling Landry that he likely won’t be healthy next season (but if that is the case it would be a moot point for the Skins to tag him).
For me with Landry missing so much time (and tackles) his value is say 60% of what you’d expect it to be for such a highly drafted and touted player, if he comes back healthy he can move that value up to say 75-85% range and get one year at 100% value. Sure there is some risk there, but the reward is probably greater, and with another healthy season, instead of settling for say 35-45% of his money guaranteed, he’d get 50-60% of his deal’s money guaranteed.
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
I would be willing to take whatever that value proposition is in draft picks
a 2nd? great
a 3rd? so be it
part of a package to move up and get a big-time rookie? ideal
I leave it to LaRon and his agent to get the best deal for him. I think the best deal for the Redskins is to get a solid rookie or two in return for trading him.
The real question is how low is his value around the league? I have to believe there is a team or two that thinks they could plug him in as a missing piece…and trust me, I agree that his trade value is diminished.
by Ken Meringolo on Dec 13, 2011 4:44 PM EST up reply actions
2nd or 3rd is a pipe dream in my opinion. I think you're looking at like a 5th rounder
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That seems a bit low
Hell, we got a fifth for fatty and he was a malcontent. Landry should be fully healed by the time next season starts. I think a third is reasonable.
You'd have to throw in his monkey to get that
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I think it would be fairly low, like 4th or 5th round range with that FA tag hanging around his neck
if he had a couple years under contract then maybe a team would bite for a 2nd, but I can’t imagine they would pay that.
Like with anything though it only takes one dumb owner, but unfortunately we are usually the team that makes that bad decision, and not to make light of the loss, but Al Davis is no longer with us either (and of course they don’t have any draft picks next year).
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
First of all
Nobody is gonna trade any value for an underachieving, injury prone, over zealous safety. So this whole point is moot. But his agent knows he needs along term deal, an I’m sure he does too. There is no guarantee that he will get a better deal after next year. There is no guarantee that he will be on the FIELD after next year. His best bet is to sign the best LONG TERM deal possible.
Where do they teach you to talk like this? In some Panama City "Sailor wanna hump-hump" bar, or is it getaway day and your last shot at his whiskey? Sell crazy someplace else, we're all stocked up here.
Best point all day
First of all Nobody is gonna trade any value for an underachieving, injury prone, over zealous safety.
Editor at Hogs Haven - Redskins Blog
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
You are crazy! There is tons of value for a guy who flexes his guns after tackling a guy who just made a 1st down.
UVA and Virginia Tech students have a lot in common. We were all accepted to Virginia Tech.
by Jeff Bernard on Dec 13, 2011 2:53 PM EST up reply actions
nobody understood that joke at the game
Counting cards isn't illegal. It's frowned upon, like masturbating on an airplane.
1. I wouldn’t draft a left tackle unless he has the ability to start on the right side as well. Trent had a poor pre-season and start of the regular season (in pass pro), and there’s this whole drugs thing. But since about week 3/4 he started to come into his own. They put him one on one with Ware and he shut him down for the most part. Trent is this franchise’s left tackle going forward in my opinion.
2. I still believe Cooley will come back well next year, but I think we should and will bring back Fred. And I think Fred becomes the starter. Davis can be the stud TE, I think he’s shown that this season.
3. If we have to trade up for a QB (I still think a trade for Luck is on, just a gut feeling) then I’d be ok with trading Landry. If he could get us a 1st/early 2nd round pick then I would probably take is aswell. Otherwise, I’m resigning or franchising LaRon.
4. No love for Gaffney? I don’t see us bringing in Wayne, would go against the youth movement we have had these past few years. If we bring in a FA, I could see Bowe being the top target if he is available. Otherwise let Hank continue to progress, and keep Moss and Gaffney going. (I like Paul aswell, good shout there).
5. Not a popular opinion, but I would have cut Sellers this year. Darrel Young is a really good young FB and has taken the job, Sellers isn’t gong to beat out Fred or Cooley at TE. He’s a great special teamer, but there are hundreds of young guys out there desperate to make a team that can play special teams.
6. Brees isn’t leaving the Saints. We could offer the guy $200m and he’d stay with the Saints.
7. Despite his heroic throw on Sunday, I would bring in a guy as competition and keep the best player.
8. I’m no special teams expert, so I can’t say how much is on Smith.
9. I live in the UK and have only been to FedEx field once when I was younger, can’t really give an opinion here.
10. What Orakpo has improved on this year is his run support. He’s drastically improved at setting the edge, forcing the run back inside and making plays. I think we all feel like his pass-rushing has been a bit underwhelming this year. A lot of his sacks have come when he’s been put against a TE or RB. He says he’s a read and react guy rather than a move guy which is why we don’t see this arsenal of moves that other pass-rushers have. They haven’t moved him around too much, but I think that may be because we have Kerrigan on the other side. One of the big advantages of the 34 is that you never know where the blitz is coming from. But I’m guessing they are trying to keep it simple for Kerrigan’s rookie year, as we haven’t seen that many stunts from either of them. I don’t know exactly how he’ll improve his pass-rush, if he’s not going to be a move guy then all he can do is watch as much film as possible on the LT he’s up against to get to know his tendencies etc. I will say, a good pass-rush isn’t just sacks. If he can push a tackle back and force a QB to have to move off his spot and re-set, that disrupts the QB’s timing and can work just as well. Brady threw quite a few passes that were behind targets or completely missed them and that was a result of disrupting his timing and him having to re-set.
If a guy can play LT than he will be able to handle the right side, and by no means should we say with certainty that TW is our LT of the future
he could be, but its also possible that he never takes his game to the next level.
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
by Steve Shoup on Dec 13, 2011 2:20 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
He only takes him game to the next bong hit
Counting cards isn't illegal. It's frowned upon, like masturbating on an airplane.
He was playing at a pretty high level
Up until his suspension. If he plays at that level he’ll be an above average LT in this league if not more. There are a lot of teams in the league right now that would be happy with Trent as their LT for the next 10 years.
He was improving his last few games
but even then I think it would be a stretch to say he was in the top 15 LTs in football. I hope he improves, but at this point he has not earned his $10 mil per year
When I was a kid, my father told me, "Never hit anyone in anger, unless you're absolutely sure you can get away with it." -Russell Ziskey
Trent has been better this year, but he's still pretty far from dominant
Would a team like the Cards or Vikings love to have TW sure, but that is mostly on the fact that he still has plenty of upside. I’m sure there are maybe 5-10 more teams that would take him, but that is either b/c their LT is near the end of their career or worse than what we have.
I’d say there is a strong possibility that TW is never anything more than a really good RT (which isn’t bad), but that isn’t exactly what we are looking for.
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
I think we've been through this
But aren’t you advocating drafting an O lineman in the first because a QB can “bust”? I agree with your statement about Trent, but that only proves the point that drafting an O lineman is just as risky as drafting a QB.
Where do they teach you to talk like this? In some Panama City "Sailor wanna hump-hump" bar, or is it getaway day and your last shot at his whiskey? Sell crazy someplace else, we're all stocked up here.
Maybe
Maybe not. I know plenty of high first round flops on O line. Granted, there are more quarterbacks taken high than O linemen, but I don’t know about the actual percentage. I’d have to look into it more. Even so, the QB has much more value. It’s a higher risk/higher reward type thing, really. And it’s about time we got the higher reward. Can’t be scared to get better.
Where do they teach you to talk like this? In some Panama City "Sailor wanna hump-hump" bar, or is it getaway day and your last shot at his whiskey? Sell crazy someplace else, we're all stocked up here.
I wouldn't say I'm advocating drafting a tackle over a QB, more that I'm advocating that drafting a QB in the first isn't the only way, and maybe not even the best way to improve
Mainly I’m saying that the trade back approach to get say 6 guys in the top 3 rounds over 3 guys is a viable option and one that I’d probably do. Now there are a lot of factors including what juniors come out (not just at QB), how the players look at the All-star games and offseason workouts, and what exactly you’d get back in trading back
Overall OT’s have a higher success rate than QB’s especially if we are looking at top 10 or 15 picks. Yes there are some down right busts who never become good offensive linemen, but a lot of OT busts are still better than QB busts. Guys like Leonard Davis and Robert Gallery couldn’t cut it on the outside, but became very productive guards. Others like Willie Anderson, (and this is what TW might do) went to RT and became Pro Bowl on high caliber players there. Offensive linemen also are much more apt to start day one (though maybe at RT, which is probably what we should have done with Williams), which helps increase their value.
Yes on a player per player basis, i.e. the top QB Rodgers vs the top LT Thomas, QB’s have more value, but in all honesty you are going to need both to win.
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
Of course
You need a LT and QB to win. But it is much easier to win with a first round QB than a first round LT. Go down the list of the top teams in the league. NONE of them have a first round left tackle except Baltimore, and they didn’t even draft him. But out of Green Bay, Baltimore, Pittsburgh, New Orleans, and New England, only two don’t have first round QB’s. And Brees was the top of round two ( I know, doesn’t count), and Brady is an anomaly, no point discussing.
Where do they teach you to talk like this? In some Panama City "Sailor wanna hump-hump" bar, or is it getaway day and your last shot at his whiskey? Sell crazy someplace else, we're all stocked up here.
honestly I'm not a huge fan of just looking at a few teams because it allows for oversimplification
but using those 4 teams, the Packers have now spent first rounders in back-to-back years along their offensive line, and don’t be shocked if next season Sherrod and Bulaga (who is turning into a stud) are their starting LT’s. The Ravens have their own first rounders at both LG (Ben Grubbs) and RT (Oher). New Orleans hasn’t used a 1st rounder on a lineman since Jamaal Brown, but that is partly due to the fact that their 2nd-5th round guys are actually developing. And New England has 1st rounder as a starter (Mankins) but used another one this year (Solder) to replace Light longterm. The Steelers only have one first rounder in Pouncey, but continued to show a need at the position with a 2nd rounder, and will likely spend another 1st or 2nd rounder on the line this year.
And here’s the thing, if we had been spending recent 2nd, 3rd, 4th and even 5th rounders along the offensive line we might not be in such a dire position. But we’ve ignored the line (and yes Shanny as well) and now we have weak starting talent and zero depth behind them. If these teams hadn’t been able to construct their lines through mid-round picks, do you think they would have never picked a first rounder?
Also part of the problem with using a short list like this is outside of Flacco, these are the 4 QB’s in the league that are so amazing that they can still find some success even behind not as good of lines. They are the exceptions to the rule. Look even at recent top picks Stafford and Bradford. Stafford missed more time than he played his first two years, b/c his line couldn’t keep him protected. And their line play has fallen off this season, which has led to the team falling off. Bradford, Brandon Lloyd and Steven Jackson are far better than our ‘big three’, yet the Redskins have the better offense (even ignoring their defensive woes). Why? b/c their line is one of the few that is worst than ours.
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
I said high
First round picks. None of those O linemen were high first round picks but Oher, and he has been a disappointment. But the reason I use those teams as comparison is because they are the best teams I’m the league, on a consistent basis. I have no problem spending first round picks on O linemen, but most O linemen are taken LATER in the first round. As I’ve said before, the best teams keep the best lines because they are usually pickin at the bottom of the first round, where most O linemen go.
As for your St. Louis example, it’s a poor choice for your argument. They’ve invested multiple high picks in their O line, and it is terrible. Again, not saying they should qui trying to upgrade it, just saying that drafting an O lineman high can go either way as well.
Where do they teach you to talk like this? In some Panama City "Sailor wanna hump-hump" bar, or is it getaway day and your last shot at his whiskey? Sell crazy someplace else, we're all stocked up here.
I don't know
I’d say there are typically at least 2 OL taken in the top 15 (not every year, but a rough average), so it isn’t as though the position is ignored at the top of the draft like say Safety or Tight End. And the success rate is pretty high (again not everyone ends up a stud LT, but there are very few true busts…in the top 15).
That is why I’m not in favor of just looking at the top teams, b/c we aren’t in the same boat as them. Only one of those teams are quarterbacked by a guy who went in the top 15, the Steelers with Big Ben in 2004 (and before we use that as a positive example let’s remember that Pittsburgh under Cowher went to the playoffs behind Neil O’Donnell, Mike Tomzack, Kordell Stewart, and Tommy Maddox in the previous 10 years before Roethlisberger). So while I wish we had the quality personnel people and time to sit and develop players, we don’t. The reason why these team’s don’t have any top 10 or top 15 picks along their line is due mainly to the fact that they never pick there.
You’re right the Rams have invested and failed along the line, which shows that the Redskins should be so satisfied with only adding 1 or 2 pieces (particularly if they aren’t elite stars). And while Jason Smith is a cautionary tale, look at the other two top 10 tackles drafted that year. Andre Smith is now firmly entrenched at RT (and playing really well), while Eugene Monroe looks to be an absolute stud top 5 left tackle material (he’s not there yet, but he is easily top 10). And again there are far more cautionary tales at QB than OT.
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
by Steve Shoup on Dec 13, 2011 10:59 PM EST up reply actions
I don't think
You’re understanding what I’m saying. My point is, we have a left tackle. That is the only position you draft top 10, probably top 15. If you are ready to give up on TW, that is a different discussion. But if you even remotely think Williams can still be your LT, you just don’t spend a high pick on an O lineman. I don’t care how bad you want to improve your line, it’s just not the right value. You want to trade back? That’s a different story. And 99% of the time I’m in favor of that. But when you’re in position to draft one of the top QB’s, and you need, NEED a QB ,you can’t afford to trade back. Sure, spending a high pick on a QB is the biggest gamble in football. But, to get better, you can’t be afraid to gamble. And spending a lower pick on one ain’t too short on risk either, by the way. We found that out with Campbell, and Ramsey. And, like I’ve said dozens of times, I’m tired of settling for the guy with the project/low ceiling label.
I don’t wanna take the girl to prom that nobody else asked. I want the chic that everyone covets. Sure, the risk of rejection is close to nil with the fugly chic. But the potential for fireworks that come with the hot chic are worth the risk.
Where do they teach you to talk like this? In some Panama City "Sailor wanna hump-hump" bar, or is it getaway day and your last shot at his whiskey? Sell crazy someplace else, we're all stocked up here.
Dunno what happened
To my paragraphs. Stupid iBad, makes me look like washingtonwin.
Where do they teach you to talk like this? In some Panama City "Sailor wanna hump-hump" bar, or is it getaway day and your last shot at his whiskey? Sell crazy someplace else, we're all stocked up here.
by CJHutch on Dec 14, 2011 8:32 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
haha
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
A couple of things
1. With the new rookie cap, it will change how picks are made. In the past you saw high price positions drafted near the top of the draft (i.e LT, QB, WR, DL, CB), these positions are the priciest in the free agent market, but they were the only ones where it made sense drafting at the top (with some exceptions) because, top 5 and even top 10 picks made so much money. Essentially if you used a top 5 pick you were signing a ‘Franchise player’. That made it tougher to use a pick on a player who would be a safety, OLB (esp. one that didn’t rush the passer), RB (in recent years), G/C/RT. While top LT’s make $10 million+ per year (which is what TW signed for as the 4th pick), top G/C make $7-7.5 million a year, and top RT’s make $5-7 million. Now though with the rookie cap, even if you draft a guy to play guard in the top 5, he’s going to make well below the top range, and he won’t set any precedents. Over the next 10 years since money is no longer a factor you will probably see more players drafted due to talent and not position.
2. There were serious question marks about TW before the suspension being a top notch LT, and those have obviously expanded. grabbing a guy who can play LT isn’t a horrible idea. Look at the Cowboys, they took Tyron Smith (who has been a stud at RT) in the top 10 and resigned Doug Free for LT. It wouldn’t shock me in a year or two to see them swap tackle spots as Smith clearly looks to be the superior player.
3. I am talking about trading back, because we need help at a multitude of positions, and I don’t see Barkley and Griffin as the be all, end all of QB’s. It is a deep QB class and if guys like Tannehill and Weeden have strong Senior Bowl performances (not necessarily the game, but the entire week, and Barkley and Griffin don’t improve their stock in workouts, I can make a strong case for waiting.
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
by Steve Shoup on Dec 14, 2011 10:00 AM EST up reply actions
1. Regardless of the rookie scale, the top picks are still gonna command more money. Which means if you drafted a right tackle top ten, he would basically command the money of a high drafted left tackle. But that’s beside the point. It’s still about value. The only position outside of LT that may hold that much importance is center. But if Maurice Pouncey isn’t worth a top 10 pick, then no center is. The rest of the positions just don’t hold the importance. And don’t take that as me downplaying their importance on the field, take it as me saying that it is much easier to “coach them up” then any other position on the field. Thats why guys like Montgomery and Lichtenwhoozle are in the league.
I agree that TW has been a disappointment. And I’m definitely not convinced he’s our future at the position. But I think we have to give him one more year at least. Also, unlike Oher, I don’t think he would handle a “demotion” very professionally. He just seems to lack that maturity. Which is why we need to be ABSOLUTELY positive when we replace him, because we could very well be running the risk of seeing him check out mentally.
As for Dallas, yes, they basically drafted a right tackle. But it wasn’t as simple as that. They weren’t sure they were gonna resign Free at the time , for one. But they also weren’t completely convinced Free could handle the left side on a full time basis. The other part of that equation though, the one I am loathe to admit, is that Dallas is leaps and bounds ahead of us in talented personnel, so they could afford to draft such a project.
3. Again, I always like the idea of trading back. But this will be the first time in a LONG time we will be in a position to draft one of the top tier QB’s. And given our desperate need for stability at the position, I just don’t think we can pass it up. I understand you don’t think Barkley or Griffin are “worth it.” Well, I do. As do many others. But neither of us matter. What matters is what Shanny thinks. And if he doesn’t deem one of these guys worth our top pick, then I don’t want him to grab them. He already showed he is not willing to “settle” when he passed on Gabbert. But I believe he will deem one of these guys worthy, and I believe he will pick a guy who will hopefully fortify the position for us for the first time in over twenty years.
Where do they teach you to talk like this? In some Panama City "Sailor wanna hump-hump" bar, or is it getaway day and your last shot at his whiskey? Sell crazy someplace else, we're all stocked up here.
Getting rid of DHall, now there's a bold move that should be discussed.
Editor at Hogs Haven - Redskins Blog
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
by Parks Smith on Dec 13, 2011 1:26 PM EST reply actions 3 recs
Finally someone said it
Duck Fallas!!
by believe_the_curse on Dec 13, 2011 1:28 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
this draft is DEEP at CB
but with that said I would keep him because with Brees, Rodgers, and now 3 good WRs in Dallas we are going to need the help at CB.
Beyond Dez are the WRs good in Dallas or is it the system?
Editor at Hogs Haven - Redskins Blog
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
Miles is a speed guy and Laurant is getting open and making plays
it doesn’t matter…whatever it is its working
It's not working in the Win/Loss column and they've been losing to teams with terrible secondaries
Editor at Hogs Haven - Redskins Blog
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
6th best pass offense
obviously the WRs and passing game is not the problem
I think Trent Dilfer Said it yesterday
Yards isn’t a good way to measure offense and defense. Especially defense with all the new rules
Counting cards isn't illegal. It's frowned upon, like masturbating on an airplane.
5th best passing tds and 4th best QB rating in the league
trust me if we have the same success with our new QB next year then no Redskin fan would be complaining about the offense
true fact.
But I do like Dilfers point, with all the new rules, its hard to have a good defense….even harder if your offense is good. Because that forces the other team to play keep up. Example Packers.
Counting cards isn't illegal. It's frowned upon, like masturbating on an airplane.
no it is very true you can't judge solely by yards (or points for that matter)
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
yes, but
we have no nickel back. Draft a CB in 4th round, keep DHall 1 more year then draft his replacement in 2013
When I was a kid, my father told me, "Never hit anyone in anger, unless you're absolutely sure you can get away with it." -Russell Ziskey
agreed
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
Wasn't
Barnes supposed to be that guy? Another wasted pick.
Where do they teach you to talk like this? In some Panama City "Sailor wanna hump-hump" bar, or is it getaway day and your last shot at his whiskey? Sell crazy someplace else, we're all stocked up here.
He might be better
suited for safety. not wasted…yet
When I was a kid, my father told me, "Never hit anyone in anger, unless you're absolutely sure you can get away with it." -Russell Ziskey
Maybe on OUR team
But usually safeties are good tacklers. We don’t very few good tacklers on our team, and I can’t think of one in the secondary.
Where do they teach you to talk like this? In some Panama City "Sailor wanna hump-hump" bar, or is it getaway day and your last shot at his whiskey? Sell crazy someplace else, we're all stocked up here.
tackling seems to be a lost art across the league in general
When I was a kid, my father told me, "Never hit anyone in anger, unless you're absolutely sure you can get away with it." -Russell Ziskey
Definitely
Where do they teach you to talk like this? In some Panama City "Sailor wanna hump-hump" bar, or is it getaway day and your last shot at his whiskey? Sell crazy someplace else, we're all stocked up here.
TE
I understand why you would perhaps want to draft a TE. However, I’ve done some reading up on this years prospects, and the TE position is apparently quite thin. We may be better served picking up a defensive back or o-lineman with our 3rd and 4th round picks. Perhaps take a flyer on a TE in the late rounds.
it depends on who comes out
the top 3 TE’s are all juniors, but all are considered semi-likely to likely to come out (Dwayne Allen, Orson Charles, Tyler Eifert)
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
Danny tore out those seats to avoid blackouts.
If they dont get a highly touted qb in here he may have to tear out some more.
How close was he to blackouts with those seats in?
Editor at Hogs Haven - Redskins Blog
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he wanted people to party
Counting cards isn't illegal. It's frowned upon, like masturbating on an airplane.
boom, exactly... it's a witch hunt
I dont know
1) Club level doesn’t count towards blackout, so that’s out of the equation.
2) If the team is ever close to a blackout I would think it would be miniscule numbers like once or twice a year (like 5,000 tickets max) and the team can purchase those tickets at $0.34 to avoid a blackout, that’s $3,400. So what’s cheaper for Snyder? Paying like $10,000 a year to avoid blackouts? Or demolishing two sides of the stadium and building a party deck?
If the team was trying to avoid blackouts then why move the band to a section that doesn’t count? (small numbers, but point remains.
Maybe Snyder is actually trying to do something for the fans? Kind of like the new jumbotrons, was he just trying to get rid of seats or actually improve the fan experience? Seems like a costly investment just to get rid of seats.
Put your pitchfork down and think about it for a second.
Editor at Hogs Haven - Redskins Blog
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
Wow Parks as I read this I was thinking....this guy and me are on the same page
then I read it was you…..I still agree. I think Dan is trying to copy what has been done with the Caps, slow rebuild, and bring the fan experience up so fans want to come.
Counting cards isn't illegal. It's frowned upon, like masturbating on an airplane.
please dont tell me you think there is actually a waiting list for tickets
or that the emails this season offering “player returned” tickets are really that? The Skins are having a terrible time selling tickets and anybody could call Ashburn right now and buy season tickets immediately. The stadium looked empty for most of Zorn’s 2nd year and many, many people called it quits on the investment after that. It aint cheap and the economy isnt great.
They're turning a page in DC
Its to expensive for Shanny to get a new stadium just yet, so he’s finally trying to listen to the fans and make it a better fan experience. He’s not a dumb business man, if he was the Redskins wouldn’t be one of the most profitable teams…he’s finally realizing that it takes patience to build a team and that the fans are losing interest. He is bringing the fun back to the stadium 1 fan at a time.
Counting cards isn't illegal. It's frowned upon, like masturbating on an airplane.
by jbh1190 on Dec 13, 2011 2:16 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Where did I say anything remotely close to this effect?
please dont tell me you think there is actually a waiting list for tickets or that the emails this season offering "player returned" tickets are really that?
It aint cheap and the economy isnt great.
Exactly dude, so why would Snyder invest millions into stadium improvements? For the hell of it? Snyder has been a terrible owner from a fans point of view but he’s finally doing what everyone has asked him to do (stay out of the way and improve the fan experience), but people like you won’t even remotely let the guy turn the corner from the past. Snyder inherited FedEx, he didn’t build it, and its a piece of crap. I applaud him for the changes he’s made in and outside of the stadium the past couple of years. There doesn’t have to be a conspiracy theory behind everything. It’s also awesome to see the influx of tremendous college games and other events at FedEx.
Like I said, it would be cheaper for Snyder just to buy the tickets at $0.34 to avoid a blackout then tear down portions of the stadium and renovate it for other experiences.
Editor at Hogs Haven - Redskins Blog
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People like me get calls/emails everyday to buy season tickets
There is no waiting list and the “player returns” are just tickets they are trying to sell.
Skins reps call and email people everyday trying to get them to buy tickets. That’s after 10,000 seats were removed. The demand just isnt there anymore and it’s pretty obvious when you find yourself in a half-empty stadium with 50% of the people there being opposing fans.
but i do agree, good for Dan spending money on improvements the fans who do go deserve them for sure.
What does this have to do with anything we've discussed?
People like me get calls/emails everyday to buy season tickets
There is no waiting list and the "player returns" are just tickets they are trying to sell.
Skins reps call and email people everyday trying to get them to buy tickets. That’s after 10,000 seats were removed. The demand just isnt there anymore and it’s pretty obvious when you find yourself in a half-empty stadium with 50% of the people there being opposing fans.
If the team gets better tickets sales goes up, its as simple as that.
Editor at Hogs Haven - Redskins Blog
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Parks
This is exactly the problem with Snyder. He’s trying to sell the fans jumbo trons, love seed momma jump post game concerts, party decks, and all the luxury amenities in the club level. He’s trying to sell the fans everything except the one thing that really matters, FOOTBALL!
What would you like him to do better on the football side? Stay out the way?
He’s doing what an owner is supposed to do at this point.
Editor at Hogs Haven - Redskins Blog
Twitter: @RVAparks Check it out for the latest Redskins news and opinions
how is this Snyder's fault?
He went out and hired a real executive and Mike Shanahan (who is the 2nd or 3rd highest paid coach in the NFL) to run the ship.
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
by Steve Shoup on Dec 14, 2011 10:02 AM EST up reply actions
NO FREE AGENCY MOVES
try that one for a change and if colby fleener is available in round 4 or 5 give him a shot
by alwaysremember21 on Dec 13, 2011 1:31 PM EST reply actions
that would be impossible since the Redskins have a number of holes, and a ton of money to spend
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
I believe that you have to fill holes not put plywood over them
which is what this franchise has done for years.
I suggest DRAFT DRAFT DRAFT
by alwaysremember21 on Dec 13, 2011 5:12 PM EST up reply actions
doesn't matter you still need to sign some players
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
Doesn’t minimum payroll 89% of the cap come into existence next year though? If it doesn’t its the year after, so teams are going to have to spend.
I believe it is the year after, but yes that is exactly part of the reason why we need to use FA
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
no one here is suggesting that they should (well some people are making crazy assertions, but in general)
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
Gaffney Stallworth Anderson-NEVER AGAIN
by alwaysremember21 on Dec 14, 2011 1:08 AM EST up reply actions
Well Gaffney was a trade and quite obviously needed
not a fan of Stallworth or Anderson, but injuries have now made them more necessary and lets be honest Stallworth is better than Austin and Armstrong.
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
by Steve Shoup on Dec 14, 2011 10:03 AM EST up reply actions
What do we need them for this year or the future?
I couldnt care less about our win loss record this year I didnt need 14 weeks of the season to tell you grossman and beck suck and this team wasnt goijg to the playoffs
by alwaysremember21 on Dec 14, 2011 2:02 PM EST up reply actions
1.Yes, we need tackle in the second round.
2. No to the TE, Cooley and Davis are fine for next year. Hell, Cooley and Paulsen are fine for next year. Address TE in 2013 if Davis leaves.
3. Landry stays. We won’t be able to trade him and get fair market value in return. If we resign him, we keep him.
4. Yes need to upgrade WR. I think Bowe would be better, but definitely think we need to add somebody.
5. Sellers will not be back. He was a nice role player. I wish guys like TW and Davis had his attitude
6. We can try to go after Drew Brees in the offseason and I can try to date a supermodel in the offseason. Neither the Redskin or me will land are targets
7. Yes, replace Banks. I would love to take either of the two Florida RB in the 4th or 5th round to return kicks and be a 3rd down back
8. Smith is fine, Gano is the problem
9. Professional sports has made it too expensive for the average fan to go to games anymore, so they don’t need all those extra seats for the general public
10. Orakpo is fine. Leave him alone
When I was a kid, my father told me, "Never hit anyone in anger, unless you're absolutely sure you can get away with it." -Russell Ziskey
If we let Landry walk, what are the odds of getting a 2013 third round compensatory pick? Assuming we don’t sign more FAs than we lose. At this point I’d be fine getting that pick.
The Panthers got a 3rd round pick for Julius Peppers, no way Landry draws anything close to that.
Editor at Hogs Haven - Redskins Blog
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Haynesworth was the reigning DEFENSIVE PLAYER OF THE YEAR.
Housh was an all-pro and lead the league in receptions. How is that remotely comparable to Landry?
Editor at Hogs Haven - Redskins Blog
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if we let him walk, we'd likely get a 3rd round compensatory pick...
but they would still weigh the net value of the departed with the net value of the newly signed I think?
I think the fact he was a first rounder gets us back decent compensation there
by Ken Meringolo on Dec 13, 2011 1:36 PM EST up reply actions
How?
if we let him walk, we’d likely get a 3rd round compensatory pick…
Editor at Hogs Haven - Redskins Blog
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of course I could be wrong, but there is a formula involved and...
It has to do with when teams lose more qualifying free agents than they gained in the previous year in free agency. It also has to do with how much your lost free agent signs for. If Landry signs a top-dollar contract, we actually get more compensation than if he signed a smaller contract.
Landry would likely be paid well, which would boost his compensatory value for the Skins. It would then come down to who else we lost. If it was just Landry, and he signed for a healthy contract, we would probably get a 3rd rounder
by Ken Meringolo on Dec 13, 2011 1:49 PM EST up reply actions
No one knows the formula, but if you're using contract amount...
how would a deal for Landry remotely compare to the Haynesworth or Peppers deal?
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You'd have to look at the overall loss and gain of that team in that year.
by Ken Meringolo on Dec 13, 2011 1:52 PM EST up reply actions
I understand that, but once again that's not the formula.
How would we be even close to losing what Tennessee and Carolina lost?
Editor at Hogs Haven - Redskins Blog
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that is the formula...
you have the “loss” part nailed…but you have to look at what they gained that same period.
That is how they base it on.
We can disagree all day, but I believe that if all we did was lose LaRon Landry and he signs a deal that pays him well, we would get a decent comp pick. I have said 3rd round, but maybe it is 4th round.
Either way, the formula is exactly what I said it was at 1:49 above. But because it is proprietary, we will not know how each component is weighed.
by Ken Meringolo on Dec 13, 2011 2:30 PM EST up reply actions
That IS NOT THE FORMULA though, you are WRONG.
Via John Clayton:
The NFL Management Council determines the number and value of the compensatory picks, and it guards the secrecy of its compensatory formula like Coke guards its secret recipe. This much is known: The NFL formula is based on salary, playing time, postseason awards and the net of free agents lost versus free agents signed.
Editor at Hogs Haven - Redskins Blog
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Which is why
We never get any decent comp picks. We always sgn more FA’s then we lose, and our guys don’t make the Pro Bowl, or playoffs (let alone get "postseason awards…hahaha)
Where do they teach you to talk like this? In some Panama City "Sailor wanna hump-hump" bar, or is it getaway day and your last shot at his whiskey? Sell crazy someplace else, we're all stocked up here.
Bingo... I've been trying to get this across for like an hour now, haha
What Ken is saying is only one part of the equation, it’s not the total equation
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Jesus Parks
I was never laying out the total formula. We don’t know it.
I was just commenting on your incomplete thoughts. Do you drink all day long?
by Ken Meringolo on Dec 13, 2011 4:26 PM EST up reply actions
You said: "that is the formula"
I hadn’t eaten lunch yet and was very hungry, that’s when I put words into caps, sorry to scare you.
Editor at Hogs Haven - Redskins Blog
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Hang on a second
Should we be getting something for Carlos Rogers?
First-round pick, decent player, better than ever contract, and is among the league leaders in interceptions
The world looks mighty different when you're peeking out your belly button
by Skins Fan '77 on Dec 13, 2011 5:13 PM EST up reply actions
nope
even if we didn’t sign more FA’s than we lost, Rogers would have only net us probably a 6th rounder.
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
Well it is SOMETHING
But I read your post below and realize we won’t get anything because of our free agent signings
The world looks mighty different when you're peeking out your belly button
by Skins Fan '77 on Dec 13, 2011 5:16 PM EST up reply actions
yeah
but the thing that I wanted to make clear is Rogers production isn’t the key. He could set the league record in INT’s and it wouldn’t do much to help out the compensation value.
It obviously would have been nicer to get more value for these guys, but it’s hard to argue with our FA signings.
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
some guys have reversed engineered it fairly well, but while it isn't 100% known
one thing that is clear is the fact that salary matters most in any formula.
Last year the Titans and Packers got comp. picks at the end of the 4th round for the loss of Kyle Vanden bosh and Aaron Kampman. Now Vanden Bosch did play better so it makes sense that he was first (but he also signed for more money). Yet the Eagles only got a 7th rounder for Jason Babin, who signed a 1 year deal with the Titans, despite the fact that he played in every game, and was among the league leaders in sacks and went to the Pro Bowl. Babin’s numbers were arguably better than Julius Peppers (who netted the lone 3rd rounder), yet his comp pick was 138 picks later.
And all of that comes after the whole cancelation process which will eliminate any chance of us getting a pick for Landry (b/c we will def. be signing as good or better FA’s). This is also why we won’t get a pick for Carlos Rogers this year, b/c we signed a number of ‘ranked’ free agents, and all to more money and years than Rogers got.
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
yeah but he didn't last year,
he was part of the dream team signings this past year. He was on the Eagles in 2009 and signed with the Titans for a year (I think it was about $2-3 million), which is why the Eagles got the 7th rounder for him. Now he came back this year and the Titans will get a 3rd or 4th rounder come April if they didn’t sign as many guys as they lost (I think Hasselbeck might cross out Babin but I’m not sure)
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
arguments over compensatory draft picks are the biggest waste of time ever
that is why I did not bring it up in the column.
by Ken Meringolo on Dec 13, 2011 4:39 PM EST up reply actions
yeah for a Skins fan it makes zero sense since we are basically guaranteed to be active in FA
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
the biggest issue is the value of the contract no knows 100% what the formula is
but it is quite clear that the value of the deal is the key component. I went in some detail below with Parks, but essentially if we were getting a comp pick for Rogers and the Ravens were getting one for Wilson, they’d probably get one in the 5th round while we’d be lucky to get a 6th rounder, and that is despite the fact that Rogers has played better, has more picks, is going to the playoffs and likely the Pro Bowl. The fact that Wilson got more money weighs more than Rogers better stats.
So unless Landry was signing at Polamalu money we wouldn’t get a 3rd rounder. If Landry were to get a 4-6 year deal at around $5-6 million a year, it should come in for a 4th rounder.
But honestly it is all a moot point b/c you only get comp picks if you sign less guys than you lost, and with $45 million in cap room I’m guessing that won’t happen.
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
I see that TEN and CAR got 6th and 7th rounders as well. But looking at all of the picks, it is pretty impossible to figure out.
usually the NFL will announce who the picks are for after they are given out so it is just a matter of trying to reverse engineer the formula
it’s not perfect, but it is clear that the money signed for is the biggest issue
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
I'd like to see Rak and Kerrigan switch sides more often and have Kerrigan in the Dirt with Rak behind him
Also I don’t like the Idea of Reggie Wayne, we don’t need another pot smoker on this team
Please don’t bring anymore tight ends lets roll with the talent we have and upgrade other positions
Draft a tackle in round 2 or 3
Draft a wr in round 2 or 3
Get a FA MLB
Keep drafting OLinemen
Draft our QB round 1
Bring in a young WR not a old one
Have Hank and new WR at 1 and 2 with Santana in the Slot
Fred Can be our #1 TE with Cooley being our 2 i’m fine with that
We simply don’t have the talent
Counting cards isn't illegal. It's frowned upon, like masturbating on an airplane.
No Wayne. That is completely the opposite of what a rebuilding team needs.
Hank needs to get those snaps. That is what a rebuilding team does. Short term struggle for long term gain.
Starting a 33 year old WR does nothing for us, especially one who will cost more than Santana.
Please no.z
"By far the worst performers on the (R*dskins) are in the front office." – Sally Jenkins
And +1,000,000 for drafting another tackle.
We should do it with our 2nd round pick.
"By far the worst performers on the (R*dskins) are in the front office." – Sally Jenkins
I'd be fine with a Tackle or WR there anything other than a QB in 1 and those 2 in the second i'd be pissed.
Unless shanny somehow finds Brady in the 6th
Counting cards isn't illegal. It's frowned upon, like masturbating on an airplane.
But until we realize he's brady
I’d still be pissed
Counting cards isn't illegal. It's frowned upon, like masturbating on an airplane.
I'm not big on investing on a 34 year old WR
Editor at Hogs Haven - Redskins Blog
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He is the kind of player that Shanahan has been bringing to camp now for two years.
Wayne, that is…
I would be shocked if we engaged in a bidding war for his services or paid a lot to him at all, but he is the kind of guy that Shanahan likes to bring in to compete for a spot.
by Ken Meringolo on Dec 13, 2011 1:54 PM EST up reply actions
best thing you ever said
Sorry Parks guy, but Shanny loves his WRs…over the past 2 years we have been linked to every big name WR to hit the market or WRs wanting a trade. It would not surprise me one bit if we drafted a WR in the 1st round and QB in the 2nd
I would be stunned if we took a WR in the first
When I was a kid, my father told me, "Never hit anyone in anger, unless you're absolutely sure you can get away with it." -Russell Ziskey
If it was Blackmon I'd be stunned
but happy love that guy
Counting cards isn't illegal. It's frowned upon, like masturbating on an airplane.
ok it would be crazy
seeing how we would pick in the top 5 but if we trade back WATCHOUT
ya, I could see it then
When I was a kid, my father told me, "Never hit anyone in anger, unless you're absolutely sure you can get away with it." -Russell Ziskey
Oh hey new guy welcome to HH.
Are you a RedSox fan? Or you just like the idea of ColorSox and are a washington purist?
Counting cards isn't illegal. It's frowned upon, like masturbating on an airplane.
i hate all Boston teams
i’m a DC sports fan homer..
+1
Except for the Nats. I’m an oriole loyalist.
Counting cards isn't illegal. It's frowned upon, like masturbating on an airplane.
God
You poor thing. Good thing you’re not a Clippers fan. Then you’d have the trifecta of douchebag owners.
Where do they teach you to talk like this? In some Panama City "Sailor wanna hump-hump" bar, or is it getaway day and your last shot at his whiskey? Sell crazy someplace else, we're all stocked up here.
haha +1
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
They're on the upswing
the O’s on the other hand…
"And you can pass it to someone you never met, and let 'em get as high as you...you're eyes red as sh*t, mine too"
by Rekka on Dec 13, 2011 6:10 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Not talking about
The teams themselves. Just pointing out the fact that Angelos is as big an asshole as Snyder, if not bigger.
Where do they teach you to talk like this? In some Panama City "Sailor wanna hump-hump" bar, or is it getaway day and your last shot at his whiskey? Sell crazy someplace else, we're all stocked up here.
Much happier as a nats fan than an O's fan
by alwaysremember21 on Dec 13, 2011 6:17 PM EST up reply actions
Except that a lot of you were O's fans before the Nationals came to town...
And CJ, if you followed the Orioles you’d know that yes, a while ago Angelos was a meddler and jerk, but he’s been one of the least hands-on owners in baseball for a long time. Our problem is that he won’t open up his checkbook, but he’s not exactly the only one. And where have free-flowing pockets gotten the Redskins?
The fact is that the Orioles have fallen on some hard times but there is still some hope that Duquette can revive the franchise. Nationals fans, on the other hand, need to realize that their team is still a few years from contending, unlike O’s fans who know damn well that we suck. We have no delusions. So I’m not going to sit around while Nats fans self-righteously shit on the O’s because frankly, yes, you were basically .500 a year ago, but that’s still mediocrity.
I didn’t abandon my Orioles fandom because some other team rolled in to town, and I don’t think people who jumped on the Nats bandwagon have any right to shit on the Orioles because you were a fan once too.
Contrary to popular belief, I am not Jewish.
Dont count out the fans old enough to have supported the Senators
I dont think there is any hatred or rivalry between the fan bases
by alwaysremember21 on Dec 14, 2011 1:11 AM EST up reply actions
Mystics for Life!!!
UVA and Virginia Tech students have a lot in common. We were all accepted to Virginia Tech.
by Jeff Bernard on Dec 13, 2011 3:33 PM EST up reply actions
best thing I ever said?
man, here I thought I had a few good doozies last week.
by Ken Meringolo on Dec 13, 2011 2:38 PM EST up reply actions
He joined like2 days ago....dunno if he's been watching though and just not joined
Counting cards isn't illegal. It's frowned upon, like masturbating on an airplane.
Half the story
…over the past 2 years we have been linked to every big name WR to hit the market or WRs wanting a trade.
Over the past TEN YEARS we have been linked to every big name FREE AGENT to hit the market or BIG NAME PLAYERS wanting a trade.
Where do they teach you to talk like this? In some Panama City "Sailor wanna hump-hump" bar, or is it getaway day and your last shot at his whiskey? Sell crazy someplace else, we're all stocked up here.
I would far prefer Wayne to Bowe or Jackson
he should be cheaper, and far less risk
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
I agree
I wouldn’t necessarily go for Wayne, but I’d rather him than a guy who will cost the world
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
Ha-rumph.
-But Dirty30 should go via trade or free agency. A pro-bowler on the roster is great, never on the field, not great.
-Danny Smith needs some new scenery, too.
-Eddie Royal to replace Banks, he’s misused in Tebowtown, we might get him for nothin’. Former Shanny draftee.
-QB in the 1st, OL in the next 2 rounds. Young, big, fast, smart, DURABLE.
-We may all need to realize “The Man” on D is not #98 but #91.
-No veteran QB, like Brees or Manning, will be brought in because no questioning of Shanahallen will be tolerated. Only Rooks or guys already indoctrinated need apply.
EXACTLY
Kerrigan looks like he will be the better OLB, if not already
+91… again
The world looks mighty different when you're peeking out your belly button
by Skins Fan '77 on Dec 13, 2011 5:22 PM EST up reply actions
In an odd turn of events, I just met and shook hands with Ryan Kerrigan
At a sterling area strip mall
by mbedner on Dec 13, 2011 2:19 PM EST via mobile reply actions
DId you take a picture
How big is he in person?
Counting cards isn't illegal. It's frowned upon, like masturbating on an airplane.
My guess would be he's about 6'4, 270 in person
Editor at Hogs Haven - Redskins Blog
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hahaha
I get that but I met Juan Howard once when I was young, and I knew he was big but it still impressed me when I met him. I was wondering if the immense size of Ryan impressed mbender
Counting cards isn't illegal. It's frowned upon, like masturbating on an airplane.
It's kind of like when you remember a hill when you were riding you bike when you are little
and you go back now and it looks like a speed bump
Editor at Hogs Haven - Redskins Blog
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On the other hand
I met Alan May at Tommy Joe’s the other day. On TV he looks a LOT bigger. I was kind of surprised out how small he was. Unfortunately, in my drunken stupor, I told him something along those lines.
Where do they teach you to talk like this? In some Panama City "Sailor wanna hump-hump" bar, or is it getaway day and your last shot at his whiskey? Sell crazy someplace else, we're all stocked up here.
Nope no Pick just an awkward exchange on my part
It was in a parking lot. I turned my head saw him, said out loud, ‘holy shit it’s Ryan Kerrigan’ asked if I could shake his hand, had an awkward shifting of papers and my water bottle from one hand to the other and dropped most of my shit to shake his hand. Then I said its crazy to see you here, he said ‘yeah I’m here often’ then we parted ways…
by mbedner on Dec 13, 2011 2:27 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Great now JBH is going to be camping out, you've basically ruined Kerrigan's personal life today -
he said ‘yeah I’m here often’
Editor at Hogs Haven - Redskins Blog
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Dude I live in Charlestown
I haven’t been to sterling since I was like 6
Counting cards isn't illegal. It's frowned upon, like masturbating on an airplane.
I didn't even go to The sports store in frederick to me Orakpo last year...and at the time I lived 10 minutes away walking.
Counting cards isn't illegal. It's frowned upon, like masturbating on an airplane.
Simmer down dude, its a joke.
Editor at Hogs Haven - Redskins Blog
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Wasn't offended. Sorry if it came out that way, but now that I think of it
why didn’t I go see Rak?
Counting cards isn't illegal. It's frowned upon, like masturbating on an airplane.
Probably because you are abiding by the terms of the restraining order
UVA and Virginia Tech students have a lot in common. We were all accepted to Virginia Tech.
by Jeff Bernard on Dec 13, 2011 3:30 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Now that's funny
I want to get high, so high. I want to get high, so high. Sleepy, Silverback, and I are going to roll a blunt if anyone wants to join us.
by 64ShagginWagon on Dec 13, 2011 4:40 PM EST up reply actions
Seems cool.
I had a friend me Joe Flacco and he said joe was just walking around the inner harbor talking to people. being a real cool dude.
Counting cards isn't illegal. It's frowned upon, like masturbating on an airplane.
I had to spend an hour alone with Flacco once, nice guy, not too exciting
Editor at Hogs Haven - Redskins Blog
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haha it was at CAA media day in 2007, Flacco couldn't drive and his coach forgot him at the ESPNzone in Baltimore
So I had to hang out with him and play arcade games with him for about an hour. He was a cool guy, but it was just like hanging out with any other buddy in college, people forget that a lot of these guys are just normal people just like us.
Editor at Hogs Haven - Redskins Blog
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haha yea I don't know how that happened.
Editor at Hogs Haven - Redskins Blog
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did you kick his ass in pacman
Counting cards isn't illegal. It's frowned upon, like masturbating on an airplane.
He is my height (6'4"), though he really only looked around 6'3" or maybe even 6'2"
So they either aren’t accurate heights or I’m taller than I think I am. Though he definitely has about 60lbs on me…
not being sarcastic
I met chick Hernandez Saturday. Thought that was pretty cool haha
by no more kwame's in dc on Dec 13, 2011 2:48 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
hahaha it really did
I was kind of hoping he was going to have his Afro like the one he was growing during the wizards road losing streak. But he sadly didn’t
by no more kwame's in dc on Dec 13, 2011 2:51 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Love most of it.....
I would be fine with taking a T with our 2nd pick.
2&3- The TE question is tricky, especially after watching Gronk demolish our defense, but I would be hard pressed to use a DP on a TE right now…….which brings up Landry, I am really liking what I see in Gomes, but if Landry is in that game Landry limits the YAC on both of Gronks big catches. I am torn on this one, I love the presence he brings and would hate to see him go, but if he can’t stay on the field……..
Moss is another tough one, I debated in favor of keeping Moss quite a bit last offseason, but I really like what Jabar brings to the table, very tough call. I have no issues with bringing in Wayne, as long as Hank and Paul get their shot to perform.
Sellers can go.
Drew Brees? really?
Banks can go, not sure we need to go outside the roster to find our new guy.
"Please don't dominate the rap, Jack, if you got nothin' new to say."-Robert Hunter
If Drew Brees was available and your team needed a QB, you would have to inquire within
I agree with just about everyone here that Brees would not come here and New Orleans ain’t letting him walk. But if he is available, you make the call. He is a Hall of Famer with gas in the tank. We have Rex Grossman.
We could still draft a rookie to groom. We have a lot of money to spend, so I am all about spending it. Investing in Drew Brees is like putting your money in Apple stock.
by Ken Meringolo on Dec 13, 2011 2:40 PM EST up reply actions
Exactly...
It’s like when Jennifer Love Hewitt’s character breaks up in “Can’t Hardly Wait.” Every single guy takes a shot. That’s all I’m saying.
by Ken Meringolo on Dec 13, 2011 4:31 PM EST up reply actions
Do you have that on VHS?
Editor at Hogs Haven - Redskins Blog
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Director's Cut DVD
J Love is so hot. Not as much bouncing as she did in “I Know What You Did Last Summer,” but still some quality tight tops.
And Seth Green’s character is amazing.
by Ken Meringolo on Dec 13, 2011 4:48 PM EST up reply actions
not gonna lie it's an entertaining movie, a lot of good humor for a chick flick...plus J.Love
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
My take
1. Draft a left tackle that can start. Brown sucks, and TW could be lost for the season next time he decides to light up and is stupid enough to get caught AGAIN.
2. TE – deserves a look. I think we’re good with Cooley / Davis / Paulsen, but Davis is stupid enough to be a problem (see TW), and Cooley needs to stay healthy.
3. Keep Landry. Offer him a decent long term deal. We won’t get the picks to make it worth letting him leave.
4. Keep Gaffney, he’s our tallest receiver and has the highest ypc or our WRs. Give Paul more looks, and Stallworth has his moments if they don’t use him to run the love. Loving ‘tana, be he’s dropped a lot of crucial balls lately. I’m fine with a FA addition, preferrably somebody taller than 6’.
5. Agree with UK, cut Sellers. Young is looking good.
6. Wouldn’t mind Brees, but it’s not going to happen. Manning has disaster written all over it (fitting offense, media hoopla, health etc)
7. Keep Banks as QB. Just kidding. He’s #19 in avg yards per kick return, and #12 for punts. Probably skewed since he likes to run it deep out of the end zone, but he’s gotten better with that. I’d like to see him stay, but it wouldn’t break my heart if we needed to free up a roster spot.
8. I don’t worry about Smith, but Gano needs to be gone. 32nd in Field goal percentage. 32nd in extra point conversion percentage. Do we need to mention kick offs out of bounds ?
9. Been only to Fedex once, and I didn’t like the stadium. Loved RFK with all its limitations, but Fedex just feels artificial. It’s in Maryland, ferchrissakes ! Driving sucks, parking sucks, athmosphere / sound sucks (at least the time I was there). Concessions suck, too (prices and long lines). At least have a metro stop right at the freaking stadium and not a mile away. Seats suck for tall people (I’m 6’7"). Some seats behind pillars that shouldn’t even be sold. I just hate the place.
10. Other than those awful commercials, I think Orakpo is doing fine. He’s looking a lot better pass rushing than covering, but it’s getting there. No concerns.
How many wins do the Redskins have in the last 3 season combined?
Landry has been trash since day one, period.
Orakpo was expected to be the next big thing but he average at best. I mean, has he had a full sack on an NFC east QB?
No need to look for a TE. I think you’re stink flabbergasted by the play of Gronk. Shipping off Cooley and Landry might work towards boosting our number of draft picks.
Reggie Wayne?!?! You know the SECOND he plays a down for the Redskins it’s all over. Free agents go to Washington to get paid, not play. I can’t think of a single free agent that has done above average in DC.
Draft an O-lineman? No QB? If Rex Fumbleman is QB next season i hope everyone is content with ANOTHER SUB 6 WIN SEASON. Also if Rex Fumbleman is QB, AGAIN, get ready to see even LESS Skins fans at FedEx.
DAMN I WISH WE GOT CUTLER A FEW YEARS BACK.
do you know how awful the Redskins would be with Jay Cutler right now
It would have costed Jason Campbell, Brian Orakpo, Trent Williams and Kevin Barnes. No Orakpo isn’t the greatest ever, but I’m not sure how you can say he is just average at best. Okay he has one sack against the division. Division games only make up 38% of your schedule in a given year, that means that he is better in 62% of your games. Not to mention, sacks are only part of the equation, as pressures and QB hits are key stats as well, and Orakpo ranks high in this area.
As for the rest I’m not a huge TW fan, but imagine what Cutler would look like behind a non-TW Redskins line. Trent has some upside still and could end up being at worst a good RT.
Barnes isn’t great, but he’s been solid at times and he’s young and cheap.
Campbell outplayed Cutler during Cutler’s first year with the Bears, and just as essentially trading Campbell and a 2nd rounder in 2010, and 4th in 2011 for McNabb and a 4th in 2012 was dumb, so would have been making this deal.
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
38% of games
But aren’t those games the most important of the season? I’d rather he had decent games against NFC east qb’s then only great games against AFC opponents.
those wins are more important from a rivalry and playoff standpoint
but if you don’t have 9 or more wins it really doesn’t matter. In none of these 3 years were we close to a playoff team (and he still does have two more divisional games this season).
Would it be nice if he was sacking Romo, Manning and Vick more? of course, but he has some big pressures and forces penalties (remember how we won opening day in 2010). And yes the production against the division (i.e for a whole season) needs to pick up before he’s considered elite, but he’s still pretty good.
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
by Steve Shoup on Dec 13, 2011 11:17 PM EST up reply actions
Do you know what makes bears fans feel better about Cutler?
Carson Palmer and Kevin Kolb
by alwaysremember21 on Dec 14, 2011 1:13 AM EST up reply actions
you know what makes them feel worse? Kyle Orton has been nearly as good as Cutler
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
by Steve Shoup on Dec 14, 2011 10:05 AM EST up reply actions
cutler is just a lil better than grossman, their OL started playing better and cutler started taking less sacks
by alleykatt1000 on Dec 13, 2011 7:44 PM EST up reply actions
i'm not running with anything, but if they could get brees, i'd say go for it!
peyton…..no, but brees……hail yeah!
by alleykatt1000 on Dec 13, 2011 7:46 PM EST up reply actions
cutler is more then a lil better then grosmen lol
specialy now ..he is hitting his prime i watched him this year think it was against the eagles. and thought damn wish we had a qb like that.
by munson21502 on Dec 13, 2011 11:15 PM EST up reply actions
how would cutler cost us
all those players?
by munson21502 on Dec 13, 2011 11:05 PM EST up reply actions
B/c the Bears gave up that package
they gave up Kyle Orton (which equates to Campbell), 2009 1st round pick (Orakpo), 2010 1st round pick (equates to TW) and 2009 3rd rounder (equates to Kevin Barnes), Denver did throw in a 5th rounder so we would have that going for us.
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
by Steve Shoup on Dec 13, 2011 11:07 PM EST up reply actions
hmmmm
think i rather had cutler and had a chance at a superbowl last year. i know damn well if we had cutler this year we woulda went 6-0 and be up in the east right now by 2 games easy.. and i think campbell was worth more then orton back then so we might not have had to give up as much.
by munson21502 on Dec 13, 2011 11:30 PM EST up reply actions
??
how would we have gone 6-0 and be up by 2 games in the East?? our defense would have taken a huge hit, and our line without TW is worse than Chicago’s. So our line is worse, receivers worse, no Matt Forte, ST’s far worse, defense worse. Really don’t see how that translates into many wins.
Campbell was better than Orton, so maybe instead of the 3rd rounder we’d have to give up a 4th rounder or maybe eliminate that pick and the Bronocos 5th from the equation. It still would have been at least Campbell and two firsts.
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
by Steve Shoup on Dec 13, 2011 11:42 PM EST up reply actions
Thoughts
1. Take a tackle in the 2nd or 3rd. I’d prefer a LT in the 2nd who we play at RT.
2. It’s just not a move that is warranted right now given the other holes on the team.
3. I’m torn on Landry. Try to give him a reasonable 1-2 year deal, if he doesn’t like it, then we probably have to let him walk, and draft another safety around the 3rd or 4th round.
4. I’d rather go with Moss, Gaffney, Hankerson, Paul. However, if we don’t use our money in other significant ways during free agency, I’d be open to a FA WR, but not Wayne. I’d also enjoy getting another WR in the 2nd/3rd, but think that those picks would be better spend on OL. Again that depends on whether or not we get some OL in FA.
5. Sellers time has come, and I hope they tell him to retire, before they cut him. Someone mentioned that Alexander falls in the same category and should go, but Alexander also can serve as a backup at 600 other positions so he is worth keeping.
6. You consider Brees the way you at least consider any QB who hits FA. But this is such a moot point that it doesn’t even belong amongst these other discussions.
7. Bye Banks.
8. Keep danny smith.
9. Continuing to take out more seats is just silly. Winning is the problem, and making patches to try to cover that up is kind of a waste of time.
10. I think this will happen naturally as the D grows.
If we had a competent kicker, are we discussing firing DS?
West Springfield Spartans OUTSIDE LB #47
HTTR
by SpartanFS47 on Dec 13, 2011 7:20 PM EST via mobile reply actions
yes, b/c it's not Gano's fault for the blocks or bad snaps (going back to last year as well)
and it’s not Gano’s fault that Banks isn’t that good, and it’s not Gano’s fault that we have lost some creativity in our ST’s units.
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
by Steve Shoup on Dec 13, 2011 11:03 PM EST up reply actions
Excluding blocks, Gano is 26th in field goal conversion rate. That’s still garbage.
http://www.teamrankings.com/nfl/stat/field-goal-conversion-pct-net-of-blocks
To clarify
Not happy with ST play, but Gano is a bigger problem than DS IMHO.
i'm not defending Gano
my point is he isn’t the only problem on the team.
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
by Steve Shoup on Dec 14, 2011 12:40 PM EST up reply actions
Sunday's game against the Patriots is coming on NFL Replay
If anyone cares…
And having watched the game again on replay I must say..
1. The terrible personal foul call on Fletcher was kind of a make-up call for the bad “going low” foul called on Andre Carter where Grossman earns an Oscar.
2. MeAngelo Hall is a liability. Not only was his foul obvious, but his dumbass tossing of the referee’s flag is absolutely absurd. Way to hurt your team with your reckless disregard. If your feast or famine cover skills don’t get you ran out of town, your mouth and your antics will.
3. The offensive pass interference call on Moss on the tying TD pass was horrendous. NFL Replay showed it slow-mo, and with DVR slow-mo on top of that, I got a very clear look at what happened. Moss did make contact with the DB, but it wasn’t enough to knock the guy down. The DB recovered, turned on the route when Moss turned, and when he realized he was beat, he flops on the ground. It’s a damn shame that with multiple refs watching the play, nobody came over and mentioned this to the ref that tossed the flag.
4. The Skins played a damn good game. The running game showed us previews of what we might be seeing for some time to come once the offensive line is addressed.
5. Someone needs to referee these referees. Horrible calls both ways throughout the game. Shanahan gave a very generic “we just need to learn to finish games” remark in his post-game comments, but what he meant to say was “F uuuu refs!”.
ESPN had a highlight play which was that crazy Gronk run where he was on the ground but not touched.
Watching DeAngelo Hall just STAND THERE DOING NOTHING watching Gomes and Doughty trying to tackle that monster was sickening….
this is what I don't get? Why is Kyle supposed to go, but not Mike?
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
by Steve Shoup on Dec 13, 2011 11:01 PM EST up reply actions
maybe mike will go if kyle goes
i think the plan is to let kyle take over the head coaching job when mike retires in 4-5 years.i dont like either 1 of them to be honest
well at least you aren't defending Mike
look I don’t think Kyle is perfect, but considering the mess that Mike handed him I think it is amazing we’ve won as many games as we have. I know Rex is Kyle’s boy, but look he’s been better than Beck who was Shanny’s pet project, and about the same as McNabb, whom Shanny called a franchise QB (and cost us a pair of picks and $15 million last year). So I’d say plus one for Kyle in that department.
Until we give Kyle some real NFL talent on offense I don’t think he can be judged too harshly.
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
by Steve Shoup on Dec 13, 2011 11:46 PM EST up reply actions
I keep telling myself that...."Until we give Kyle some real NFL talent on offense I don’t think he can be judged too harshly."
His decision making just boggles my mind sometimes, but it seems to be less often of late (still several times per game).
I kind of consider him as part of the “youth movement” and will grow with experience with the the team. I think this could be a good thing. I don’t know that he will be ready to take over when Shanny’s current deal runs out…..If they pull this off, and we come out a serious contender within 2 years Shanyy might sign an extention.
"Please don't dominate the rap, Jack, if you got nothin' new to say."-Robert Hunter
I agree there are some calls that leave you wondering
but I think that is pretty consistent around the league. The difference is when Kevin Gilbride (Giants OC) or Jason Garrett (still calling the plays I believe) make a bad play call they have the personnel where it isn’t a disaster. We have a bad play call and it is a 4 yard loss, or a sack fumble.
Steveospeak - Content Manager of Fanspeak.com
by Steve Shoup on Dec 14, 2011 10:10 AM EST up reply actions
Interior line please
Better guard play makes for better Tackle play,
Let’s start winning games in the trenches,
Wouldn’t it be great to lineup in 3rd and 3-4 yds and force the opposition to respect the run.
by wuds100 on Dec 14, 2011 2:02 AM EST via mobile reply actions
We have major holes to fill.
The underlying theme here is that we have too many holes to fill to make all these bold moves. A QB, a new interior line and right tackle. Depth at corner and d-line should be our priorities
1. Draft a left tackle - I Disagree – You should be looking at a Right tackle Jamaal Brown is always injured, but he is serviceable as a back up. Trent Williams is going to be good. Like you said, He is still learning. You have Willie Smith who played decent against the Pats and he could play both tackle spots. tight end set any ways. Re-Sign Fred Davis and use Cooley as a back up. No need for a 3rd at this position.
2. Bring in a stud tight end why would you do this? In your article you point out that the Skins aren’t using much of a 2
3. Trade LaRon Landry on draft day—I don’t know if you can get a good draft pick given his history of injuries.
4. Starting wide receivers in 2012: Reggie Wayne, Santana Moss, Niles Paul and Leonard Hankerson— this would be a nice group of receivers if we can get Wayne.
5. The inevitable “Tough Decision” on Mike Sellers—I agree with you on this
6. Dip toes in the Drew Brees waters—Why waste our time? He doesn’t know our offense and we all know our first pick is going to be a QB. Grossman will be the care taker next year until the rookie develops.
7. Bring in a new returner – agreed, Brandon Banks is one dimensional and too small.
8. Hire a new Special Teams Coordinator – not yet, our coverage units are good, our kick offs our good. It just consistency with our field goal unit and the need for a new returner. I think we need to keep some stability until we are knocking on the playoff door.
9. Take out more seats at FedEx – No comment
10. Re-invent Brian Orakpo—agreed, anyway to exploit Orakpo’s talent would be a good thing although I did see them use him and Kerrigan together on one side a couple of times.
by A Connecticut Redskin on Dec 14, 2011 8:48 AM EST reply actions
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