Redskins WR Santana Moss Fingered as HGH Guilty Party
by Kevin Ewoldt on May 20, 2010 9:09 AM EDT
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Jamie Mottram over at Mr. Irrelevant noted the link from a Buffalo news source:
Santana Moss, a wide receiver for the NFL's Washington Redskins, is one of the professional athletes who allegedly received treatment from a Toronto physician charged Tuesday with smuggling muscle-building drugs into the United States, according to sources close to the case.
"At this juncture, any of the persons who are alleged to have used these substances are considered witnesses, and not targets, of this investigation," Hochul told The Buffalo News.
Santana would likely be suspended for 4 games by the NFL, which is a heart-breaker since the Redskins play the Cowboys week 1....whom he owns. I mean, if Cushing only got 4 games, hard to imagine Santana would get more since he allegedly only used it for healing purposes, which is of course still cheating.
New Redskins PR spokesman, Tony Wyllie, said "this is an off-the-field incident." That has to be a joke, right? What a terrible comment to make given off-the-field actions have a DIRECT correlation to, you know, PLAYING.
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4 Game Suspension?
Seems like a leap. We don’t know exactly what’s being alleged against Moss. We haven’t heard Moss’ explanation.
As far as we know Moss never tested positive for any PED by league administered tests. There is no test for HGH.
You don't have to test positive for a suspension
Hogs Haven. On Twitter. And Facebook.
by Kevin Ewoldt on May 20, 2010 9:38 AM EDT up reply actions
Fact
Although I don’t necessarily agree with that power in Goodell’s hands. Whether the Moss thing turns out to be correct or incorrect, simply saying almost automatically that he most likely will end up with a 4-game suspension based on at best circumstantial evidence reaffirms a precedent that Goodell has been doing all along.
“We may not be able to PROVE you did anything wrong, and so we don’t really know for sure, but we’re going to punish you like we CAN prove it and do know for sure.”
Foaming at the mouth from all the excitement of a "Kindergarten Ninja"-less Front Office!
That's been Goodel's policy for a while now
"We may not be able to PROVE you did anything wrong, and so we don’t really know for sure, but we’re going to punish you like we CAN prove it and do know for sure."
"By far the worst performers on the team are in the front office." – Sally Jenkins
Fair points
Right now my understanding is that the court papers don’t specifically name Moss. The Buffalo paper is saying it’s Moss. The alleged witness (Moss) is claiming he never knowingly took HGH, but had a B12 shot and a vitamin IV drip.
Now common sense would tell me this witness did more, especially if there’s a trail of checks.
My question is w/o, Moss admitting, positive confirmation in court papers, or a money trail, would the league act? Right now it’s his word vs the doc’s word.
And that's a great point
But hinges on if Moss wants to try and go the ARod route and lie to everyone insisting innocence. I hope the Redskins staff tells Moss to take his medicine and move on so it’s not a question all year long. Look at Andy Pettite…he admitted it, and now almost no one remembers about it.
It’s clear now why Shanny was stock-piling WRs….
Hogs Haven. On Twitter. And Facebook.
by Kevin Ewoldt on May 20, 2010 9:56 AM EDT up reply actions
Of course, like Cushing
It may be 4 games during the 2011 season not 2010…And by then if the younger guys step up, Moss may no longer be a Redskin in 2011…of course if the NFL has games in 2011….
by dr WNC on May 20, 2010 10:07 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
It’s clear now why Shanny was stock-piling WRs…
Do you think Shanahan knew about this? That seems like somewhat of stretch…
Definitely a stretch/guess....
Hogs Haven. On Twitter. And Facebook.
by Kevin Ewoldt on May 20, 2010 11:01 AM EDT up reply actions
If we signed Bryant it would make sense
I wouldn’t say bringing Galloway(20 catches no TD’s the last 2 seasons) would be an adequate response to a Moss suspension. I like Wade but he is a slot guy.
by BayAreaBullet on May 20, 2010 11:46 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
2 words- Big Ben
"We may not be able to PROVE you did anything wrong, and so we don’t really know for sure, but we’re going to punish you like we CAN prove it and do know for sure."
He wasn’t convicted of anything either. I know it’s completely different circumstances, but it seems to me that Goodell hammers home the point “if you make the NFL look bad you pay for it”. I see it that way more than your way.
Semper Fi Do or Die
by Jeremiah_24 on May 20, 2010 10:31 AM EDT up reply actions
The biggest difference is that Roethlisberger admitted to being in the situation and was investigated by authorities.
Moss, hasn’t and seemingly, won’t be investigated (remember, it’s the Dr. the authorities are/were after). I just don’t see how he could get suspended for being tied to this solely by a reporter in Buffalo.
"Being in the situation"
in this case is using the Dr. that performs HGH drugging. If he denies using the Dr. that’s one thing, but it could backfire if it is proven he did in fact use him- even once. He would lose credibility making him appear to be hiding something. Once that happens, if he’s accused people will ASSUME he is lying about that as well if he denies it. It’s simple- if he used him admit it and take the punishment if there is one. He is better off to cooperate and appear he is in the right. It’ll pay off in the long run.
Semper Fi Do or Die
by Jeremiah_24 on May 20, 2010 11:40 AM EDT up reply actions
It seems to me that it would make sense for him to deny everything because, assuming there is proof of him using, he’s getting 4 games regardless of if he fesses up or not.
Just to come clean later and write a book about it?
If you use it, someone knows and will tell. If I’m getting suspended I look at it the opposite, I’m admitting it if I did and walking away with a shred of integrity left. Some people make mistakes, whether they attempt to correct them or not defines their true character.
Semper Fi Do or Die
by Jeremiah_24 on May 21, 2010 12:48 AM EDT up reply actions
Oh Santana
how I wish the HGH made you 5" taller, healthier, and better.
"By far the worst performers on the team are in the front office." – Sally Jenkins
Being treated
by the HGH doctor and being treated with HGH by the doctor are I would hope be two different scenarios.
So unless either the doctor or Moss admit using HGH rather than something allowable the NFL is setting itself up for a legal situation with Moss.
by G Fan in England on May 20, 2010 9:50 AM EDT reply actions
Unfortunately,
the circumstantial evidence reads along the lines of why would you be going to this doctor (who resides in Canada) for any reason whatsoever than to get a dose of PEDs? Pretty well sucks if Moss is in fact innocent/stupid and only got the vitamin drip. He’s likely going to get at least a few game suspension just because the league is standing on it’s drug policy principle vs innocent until proven guilty principle.
Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana.
Seriously...
how is this story about Moss and not Tiger and A-Rod?
I mean, on HH, I get it, but Moss is getting more coverage everywhere. I don’t think it’s unfair or anything. I just find it odd.
My point...
Circumstantial evidence is the doctor is well known for his healing effects on star athletes: Woods, A-Rod and others.
When Woods made the statement he had not used HGH or Steroids his name was out of the headlines.
The Dr. says he did not use performance enhancing drugs on any of his patients in the suit…
Also, the wording on the CBA makes this a lot different than other cases…
if NFL players admit to having taken Actovegin, those players may not have violated the league’s collectively-bargained Policy on Anabolic Steroids and Related Substances. The policy does not explicitly list Actovegin as a prohibited substance. On the other hand, the policy does note that, “Players or other persons within the NFL who: are convicted of or otherwise admit to a violation of law … relating to use, possession, acquisition, sale, or distribution of steroids, growth hormones, stimulants or related substances .. are subject to discipline by the Commissioner, including suspension or, if appropriate, termination of the individual’s affiliation with an NFL Club.” The “related substances” might provide the NFL with justification to punish a player who uses Actovegin.
Read More: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2010/writers/michael_mccann/05/20/galea/#ixzz0oUXwS4sY
I agree
it does not sound good.
You would hope Moss makes a statement and says sorry and accepts the ban if he has been treated with HGH rather than play whilst appealing the ban only to be proved guilty after the season.
If he is clean then he should make a statement to that effect.
by G Fan in England on May 20, 2010 10:11 AM EDT up reply actions
The player is ultimately responsible for what goes into his body.
It’s his job to research. If you hire someone with a brilliant track record, this doesn’t occur because the don’t want to kill their reputation. Hire someone shady, and this is what you get. Not saying he did or didn’t, just saying he is getting lumped in regardless.
Semper Fi Do or Die
by Jeremiah_24 on May 20, 2010 10:33 AM EDT up reply actions
The guy doesn't have a license to practice medicine in the US
I think it undercuts the I was just getting treatment defense a little.
by BayAreaBullet on May 20, 2010 11:49 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Wow
I didn’t know that. Things just got a whole lot worse for Moss. I was halfway defending him too… stupid me
Semper Fi Do or Die
by Jeremiah_24 on May 20, 2010 12:14 PM EDT up reply actions
I don't think you were stupid for defending him
We don’t know how Galea represented stuff to Moss. I was just saying I think any attempt by him to offer “I was getting treatment from a Dr.” as an explanation will be problematic as Galea can’t legally practice medicine in this country.
by BayAreaBullet on May 20, 2010 12:46 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Maybe not defending, but
argueing that he had a leg to stand on from a legal aspect. That really takes that away. He can’t walk out of this clean anymore.
Semper Fi Do or Die
If True
Santana can appeal the suspension and play the whole year just like Cushing did.
When are performance enhancement drugs not really that much of an enhancement?
( when given to Santana Moss)
When Zorn is your Head Coach and Cerrato builds your O-line
Hogs Haven. On Twitter. And Facebook.
by Kevin Ewoldt on May 20, 2010 10:31 AM EDT up reply actions
Based soley on his playcalling
I’m convinced Zorn has a prescription for Medical LSD. At least that’s the only way I can convince myself that Swinging Gate was a designed play.
Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana.
Please don't be true
I really hope he didn’t take any HGH from this guy. I am a HUGE Moss fan, and I know I’m tryin to see this through rose colored glasses, but maybe it wasn’t what this Buffalo reporter is suggesting. I guess we will see.
Another Redskins is now "reportedly" linked...athlete "T"
Supposedly this Redskin got a shot in DC 9/3/10…when the Skins were in Jax. I can’t find which Redskins DNP that week…a lot of the Skins were on the IR…Cooley comes to mind but obv there were many others. Randy Thomas, etc.
Hogs Haven. On Twitter. And Facebook.
T is for Thomas maybe,
but I’m thinking Randy, Not Devin
The world looks mighty different when you're peeking out your belly button
by Skins Fan '77 on May 20, 2010 11:15 AM EDT up reply actions
They are assigned letters based on when they came up in the court papers
Hence the first witness is A. The next is B and so on. Any correlation with last names is coincidental.
by BayAreaBullet on May 20, 2010 11:51 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
And apparently T didn’t do HGH. He got “Actovegin/vitamin drip”. Does the league test for actovegin? Is it even something you can test for?
The way I understand it there is no reliable test for HGH so it’s not even something the NFL could test for. As for Actovegin, there may be a test for it but it appears it isn’t even listed as a banned substance, so “athlete T” may be clear.
HGH is tested by blood only
they can use the finger-pick blood test for it, but I’m not sure the CBA allows for blood testing. Actovegin is that calves blood stuff that is not approved. The crazy thing is that they use the centrifuge to spin a players blood to create higher concentrations of platets (by removing plasma?) then put it back into the player…I assume this is done in combination with the actovegin treatment. Crazy shit.
A newspaper in Milwaukee claims...
Donovan McNabb punched a newborn baby in the nose repeatedly…I mean, he was cocking back and following through…
…and Chris Cooley drops deuces in Cowgirl Cheerleader’s mouths while hanging from a ceiling fan…
Papers can claima anything from an unnamed “source”…when does the NFL draw the line on punishments????
Yeah, but nothing's going to happen based on tjust a newspaper.
The article is regarding the criminal investigation against the doctor though, and info that comes up in that investigation is definitely grounds for disciplinary actions.
They'll have a hard time proving that...
Seeing as how 9/3/10 hasn’t even happened yet. I wonder what the suspension is for time machine usage? If there’s a precedent, I bet it was Belichick going into the future to see what plays the other team was going to run.
You are now talking like Zorn
per my post above. LOL
Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana.
Well
at least we’re not talking about Haynesworth?
SpottieOttieDopaliscious
I can't root for that guy...i'll take my chances with anyone else.
No way I can handle covering TO’s antics on a daily basis. I did meet him at Ocho’s Super Bowl party tho….super cool dude.
Hogs Haven. On Twitter. And Facebook.
by Kevin Ewoldt on May 20, 2010 12:23 PM EDT up reply actions
After this year is over maybe he could play for NY
and be the NFC East Sl*t?? lol
Semper Fi Do or Die
No need - we'll just line up Morris, right LJP? :)
Seriously though, I’m not up for this idea, and I don’t think Shanahan would be either – we’ve brought in a TON of WRs and no T.O. so I don’t see it changing even if Moss is indeed guilty of anything and suspended.
Santana
Is it at all plausible that he saw the guy but didn’t know about the HGH? I.e., he thought he was just a good doctor, but didn’t realize he might give him illegal substances? Of course, the appointment with a non-doctor looks bad. On HGH, if he took a small amount along with other legal drugs, for the injury, it would be illegal, but morally not so bad, not really “performance enhancing” or cheating. Whatever the case, he better not lie. Just say what he did and take his medicine. If it’s a suspension, so be it.
I said the same thing above as I will now.
The player is ultimately responsible for what goes into his body. No if and’s or buts. You have the CHOICE to know what is going in. To sheild yourself from knowing just begs questions on if he wanted to use it.
As for this “but morally not so bad, not really "performance enhancing" or cheating.”
Any amount is a PED and cheating. Period
Semper Fi Do or Die
by Jeremiah_24 on May 20, 2010 12:18 PM EDT up reply actions
+1
real people take responsibility for their actions and don’t try to hide behind gray areas. I for one have no respect whatsoever for anyone who tries to hide behind such things as “deniable culpability” or, " I don’t recall".
The world looks mighty different when you're peeking out your belly button
by Skins Fan '77 on May 20, 2010 12:31 PM EDT up reply actions
It's called accountability.
True men own up to their deficiencies and move on trying to improve their behavior. I could easily take certain illegal supplements they don’t drug test for in the military, but I have a thing called integrity. I LEARN about what I put into my body and whether I get caught or not isn’t the issue. It’s right or wrong no in between. If someone you hire to come give you medicine (that can’t legally do it as pointed out to me above) doesn’t give you the right medicine because YOU didn’t investigate it is your fault.
Semper Fi Do or Die
And there isn't a doctor
in the U.S. that has B12 shots? Not buying it, pretty sure if he was going for the legal remedy he could have picked someone a little closer to home… and licensed in this country.
Sally Jenkins on drug use
I usually disagree with Sally Jenkins, but I liked her article in today’s W. Post. She basically suggested that there was a big difference between athletes taking various drugs, even HGH, to recover from an injury, and taking them to enhance their performance. I.e., motive counts. The article suggests the league should rethink it’s drug policy to account for medical use. Jocks endure far more pain than the average person, have to try to play with injuries and pain that would flatten normal people, and all this with their short careers on the line. NBC (Jim Vance, et al) pointed out that athletes don’t take HGH to improve performance, but to recover from injuries. Based on what I know now, I’m on Santana’s side. I know – rules are rules, but maybe they ought to change the rules.
But the problem is this-
The rules were in place during the infraction. That’s like getting on a highway at night when no one is there, you see the speed limit sign says 25… obviously that’s arguably an incorrect speed for a highway so you go 55. You get a ticket and later they change it. Were you still speeding? Yes. The rule is in place, regardless of right or wrong. Change the rule if you don’t want to abide by it, but until then you are wrong. If you look at the ex post facto rule its the exact opposite scenario but make it pretty clear you can’t change the rule afterwards and punish people that would’ve broken it before. When a rules in place it’s gold.
Semper Fi Do or Die
by Jeremiah_24 on May 21, 2010 12:39 AM EDT up reply actions
By change it
I’m refering to the speed limit.
Semper Fi Do or Die
by Jeremiah_24 on May 21, 2010 12:40 AM EDT up reply actions
Interesting ideas.
"By far the worst performers on the team are in the front office." – Sally Jenkins
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