Pour Some Sugar On Me - 2010 Washington Redskins: Over The Hill Gang Part Deux?
I am too young to remember what it was like when George Allen coached the Redskins. I was not even alive. But I have watched the videos a million times. I felt that indefinable thing that people caught from watching and listening to George Allen lead that team...the buzz. I recall the scene in Almost Famous where Jason Lee's character (Jeff) is explaining to William Miller what the buzz is all about, and how "the chicks and the whatever are all offshoots of the buzz."
When George Allen took the team to the playoffs in 1971, it was the first time the franchise had been there since 1945! (Wikipedia entry for George Allen). He made the D.C. team immediately relevant and there was a decided buzz in town. His two-a-day practices and famous motivational style produced a winning product on the field, but his tendency to mortgage the future to win now sparked more than a little controversy. In fact, even though Allen was the most successful coach in Los Angeles Rams history before he came to Washington, it was largely assumed that his tendency to trade away draft picks and young, raw players for veterans did not sit well with the owner, leading to his dismissal.
George Allen brought the same philosophy to Washington, assembling a group of veteran players that were known in the NFL for their hard work and camaraderie. "The Future Is Now" was his slogan and his ragtag group of older players made the playoffs in five of Allen's seven years, with the 1972 Super Bowl the farthest they ever made it. The "Over the Hill Gang" captured the hearts and minds of casual NFL fans around the country but failed to capture a championship. Once again, Allen seemed to find himself at odds with an NFL owner (this time Skins owner Edward Bennett Williams), leaving the cupboard rather bare for rebuilding the team through the draft, and Allen was not brought back for the 1978 season.
Looking back at the George Allen era, it was clear that he had found a formula for winning. What is not so clear is how sustainable that formula is over the long haul. Edward Bennett Williams famously said of George Allen, "George was given an unlimited budget and he exceeded it." Even then it was a commonly-held belief that you had to build franchises through the draft and develop young players. But from time to time, we see franchises bone up on veterans and make runs at championships, such as the Raiders in 2003 behind Rich Gannon.
More often than not though, we see teams getting to the promised land on the strength of home-grown talent, making shrewd selections in the draft and prioritizing the needs of the team over individual players.
While it remains to be seen if Bruce Allen and Mike Shanahan intend to fully channel George Allen's "The Future is Now" mantra, current events lead us to believe it is at least a factor in their decision-making. What may have seemed to most fans like an opportunity to "blow it up" and start over has transmogrified into a bit of a hybrid approach to rebuilding.
Mike Shanahan clearly has a lot of confidence in his ability to coach in the NFL. I think it would be fair to say he is back in the league for an extended stay, and I am sure he hopes it is with this franchise. One could argue he would be given a lot of leeway and patience to rebuild this roster with youth and inexperience. Surely Snyder would lay off the trigger if we suffered through a rebuilding year or two with Shanahan at the helm, right?
I guess we aren't meant to know the answer to that question. Our stable of running backs, once predicted to consist of Clinton Portis and a rookie stud, now consists of Clinton Portis and TWO aging veterans. We just brought in a 33-year old quarterback to take over the spot from our former 1st-round draft choice that MIGHT have a future in this league. It remains to be seen whether Bruce Allen and Mike Shanahan will move on some of the other veterans out there who are available at positions of need for us, most notably Flozell Adams and perhaps even Darren Sharper. The trade for Don Burgundy holds a ton of merit, but at the end of the day you still have to acknowledge that with the 2nd round pick in the 2010 draft, we selected an 11-year veteran with a few good years left (hopefully) instead of a player that could give us all 15 years of his potential career.
I think what we will get this season is a kind of back-door rebuilding process. One thing Donovan McNabb will do for this Redskins team is help us find out--very fast--what we have in Devin Thomas and Malcolm Kelly...perhaps even Marko Mitchell and Fred Davis to some degree. He will help keep our defense out of at least a few of the horrible games where the offense was capable of giving them 3 plays at a time on the sideline before punting. This will give us some early feedback on the new Haslett defense and the personnel he employs. In the coming seasons though, the question looms: Will Allen and Shanahan fill the resulting holes with proven older veterans, or start to look more and more to the draft?
I think Shanahan is keeping the needs of the team front and center, which is evident in his stance on Haynesworth. Unlike offseasons of the past, the additions we have made thus far this offseason don't smack of the "we can afford anything we want, so let's go and get the shiniest toys available." The deliberation and calculation that has seemed inherent in some of our moves lies in stark contrast to previous offseasons where the approach seemed to consist of little more than driving dump trucks filled with money to free agent's homes.
I don't think we have mortgaged our future just yet...after all, we can still probably recoup some picks with a few trades between now and the draft. I would rather be sitting in the Eagles situation to be frank--loaded with young players and 20 draft picks in the next two years. I think that would be a better spot for a team in our position. But the truth of the matter is you can win in this league by building your team with veterans and experience. If Bruce Allen decides to go that route, and gives Mike Shanahan an older core of players to work with and trust on the field, is it possible we could recapture the buzz from a bygone era? We shall see.
Image via www.mediacircus.net
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Great post, one quick fix.
But the truth of the matter is that in very rare occasions you can win in this league by building your team with veterans and experience.
So rare, in fact, that’s its not a shrewd strategy.
"By far the worst performers on the team are in the front office." – Sally Jenkins
It's also not shrewd
to draft a QB with the number 3 pick (Mr Shuler) and find out he can’t play.
But "drafting Heath Shuler" isn't a strategy
The strategy is, “draft a QB in the first round”, which, given the right circumstances*, is where most good QBs come from, and is therefore a somewhat proven strategy, even as risky and difficult as it is.
*not ours. Do it if a team already has an OL in place, and ideally a good run game and a mediocre/good veteran to play QB
"By far the worst performers on the team are in the front office." – Sally Jenkins
wishful thinking
“instead of a player that could give us all 15 years of his potential career.” Umm, wishful thinking? Esp with our o-line, are we supposed to just keep drafting top-line QBs until we serendipitously unearth the next manning/mcnabb before they become HOF’s? Sounds to me like that’s an un-innovative recipe for shooting blanks like we have been for, how long has it been, 15 yrs?
by Grand Tanyon Sturtze on Apr 8, 2010 2:00 PM EDT reply actions
I didn't say it had to be a QB
Just said that a 2nd round draft pick could give us 15 years, potentially. Wishful thinking, sure…but one player who has NO chance of giving us 15 years=McNabb. I have actually talked at length about the futility of drafting QB’s at the top of the draft (I know you have been busy hitting the books, so you are excused for not doing your summer reading here.) I continue to push for the O-line to get some major attention in the draft.
by Ken Meringolo on Apr 8, 2010 2:07 PM EDT up reply actions
Not all 2nd round picks are guaranteed 15 years
See Taylor Jacobs and Jason Campbell (very late 1st). If you’re gonna draft a QB, you need someone to groom him, and Rex and Campbell aint it.
"I am excited about starting 2009. We are looking forward to an outstanding year. We're on our way. We have a lot of healthy players this year." - Vinny Cerrato
Does anyone understand the concept of "potentially"?
Are we really debating whether or not a 2nd round pick has more potential career to offer than an 11-year veteran?
Kevin, your statement above is like saying, “The sky is blue.”
Of course not all 2nd round picks are guaranteed 15 years. Nobody is. My point is simply we went with experience over youth…I am not even saying it was wrong. I have made the argument for McNabb multiple times this week already.
by Ken Meringolo on Apr 8, 2010 2:14 PM EDT up reply actions
The sky isn't blue at night
Nor during sunsets or sunrises….then you factor in overcast days.
Point Kevin.
"I am excited about starting 2009. We are looking forward to an outstanding year. We're on our way. We have a lot of healthy players this year." - Vinny Cerrato
Isn't penciling in McNabb for 4 more good seasons also wishful thinking to an extent?
Drafting is hard work and you gotta stick with it. Thats such a losers mentality to give up on drafting guys cuz it doesn’t always work out.
by BayAreaBullet on Apr 8, 2010 2:26 PM EDT up reply actions
Amen
There are clearly pitfalls to both strategies, which is kind of also the point. Smart general managers get picks wrong all the time—especially on QB’s. Not-so-bright personnel men get lucky with free agents and trades….and vice versa.
by Ken Meringolo on Apr 8, 2010 2:33 PM EDT up reply actions
I never penciled him in for 4 more good seasons...
The thing about the QB position is the Redskins have no young guys or leaders….and it all starts at QB. If the QB sucks or is a bad leader, it affects the whole team. Pretend it’s a fact the Skins only get 3 years out of McNabb….looking back, it would most likely still be worth it.
A coach only goes so far…you need a coach on the field like what London does for the young guys. Not just on the field…but leading by example with film study, etc. Guys need someone that delivers what they preach. Campbell nor anyone they draft can be that guy now. If you’re gonna go after me on McNabb….I don’t see how you can. Drafting a 2nd rd pick (even OL) with Campbell, Rex, Colt Brennan as the leader does not advance this team.
"I am excited about starting 2009. We are looking forward to an outstanding year. We're on our way. We have a lot of healthy players this year." - Vinny Cerrato
Whoa
Not sure if you were responding to me or Ken but I’m not “going after you on McNabb”. I was just pointing out that getting 3-4 years of good play from McNabb also employs wishful thinking. When I talk of the loser mentality it is to the general contention of some(not you specifically) to say “Well draft pick X busted so who cares about that pick or building through the draft.” Where do people think these studs come from? 90% or more were drafted by somebody. Some FA’s bust and so do some draft picks.
As for drafting a QB specifically it isn’t easy and anyone who implies that is wrong. But how many great QB’s come to a new team after they are established? Most teams with great QB’s either drafted them or traded for them before they broke out(Hasselbeck, Favre(ATL-GB), Schaub, Brunell(GB-Jacksonville)). Look at the Packers. At first glance they had a really easy transistion to Rogers but they actually expended alot of resources to get that next QB. They were so unsure of Rogers at one point they used a second rounder on Brohm(total bust for them who isn’t even on their team). I doubt they are complaining about using a late first and a second rounder now. Or look at Baltimore post Dilfer. They signed Grbac to a huge FA deal that was an epic bust. Then some journeymen, Failed first rounder on Boller, trade for a couple sub JC years from McNair, more journeymen and then eventually got Flacco. I’m sure if you looked at alot of the squads with elite QB’s you would find they put alot of work and resources into finding that guy. Leaf flopped but then they got Rivers(and Brees). Didn’t the Colts draft Jeff George? Carr then Schaub. So irregardless of the McNabb deal to reject building a team and more specifically a QB through the draft because of past failures is a loser mentality.
by BayAreaBullet on Apr 8, 2010 4:23 PM EDT up reply actions
Acutally,
Due to the chemical make up of the sky, if powerful radiation were shone through the sky at night, it would still appear blue. Even at sunsets and sunrises there is still blue in the sky. Minus one point please. But both of you are wrong as the sky is blue only in appearance. But as usual I’ll agree with Sugar here, mostly because of spite Kevin.
by TheOverLordMarshl on Apr 8, 2010 3:58 PM EDT up reply actions
I didn't know you were a Scientologist
"I am excited about starting 2009. We are looking forward to an outstanding year. We're on our way. We have a lot of healthy players this year." - Vinny Cerrato
That's not scientology
That’s just science.
by Scorin' Scalps on Apr 8, 2010 5:35 PM EDT up reply actions
i don't understand the doom/gloom
esp when there was so much banal, mindless enthusiasm for jim zorn because he was a nice man and because we were going to give a stable of our young guys some heavy time on the field. all we did was find out that thomas/kelly were out of shape and couldn’t hack it — of course mcnabb will make them better but let’s hope they do something themselves — that our young backup o-line was more porous than a typhoon, and that our young depth at cornerback and safety weren’t adequate in coverage.
of course making a team can’t be chalked up to just patching together alot of FAs and knocking on wood — but it’s equally as dumb to try and forge a team simply by ‘building’ like an MLB team like the fla marlins or the tb rays. it’s a mix of both and shanahan can turn anyone, rookie or veteran, into a 1k rusher, & frequently employs a stable so it makes no difference whether we have a wannabe shonn green or willie parker, we’ve still got a very flexible, marketable #4 pick that allows us to either draft okung or trade back and assemble depth, and we’ve improved at the most critical position on the team by acquiring probably the best available QB while sacrificing less risk as we might have by drafting an uproven QB and giving up less than we would have had to in order to get the Bradford pick.
by Grand Tanyon Sturtze on Apr 8, 2010 2:01 PM EDT reply actions
"banal and mindless"???
Ouch…sometimes your words hurt…
Again, though, you are making some points here that we have been faithfully making for some time. Would hardly call our coverage banal or mindless though…looks like somebody has been studying too hard for the SAT’s!
by Ken Meringolo on Apr 8, 2010 2:09 PM EDT up reply actions
Been meaning to ask
Has Shanny ever put a 1,000 yard season up with RB’s with as much mileage as we have. I’m probably forgetting some people but it seems most of his guys were still fairly young.
by BayAreaBullet on Apr 8, 2010 2:11 PM EDT up reply actions
That's a good idea for a post...
I’ll look into it.
"I am excited about starting 2009. We are looking forward to an outstanding year. We're on our way. We have a lot of healthy players this year." - Vinny Cerrato
Is that Jason Lee in that picture?
You know, the guy from My Name is Earl. Second one in the pic. Looks just like him.
Yeah, it is Jason Lee
Haven’t you ever heard of Stillwater? A mid level band struggling with their own limitations in the harsh face of stardom?
by Ken Meringolo on Apr 8, 2010 2:22 PM EDT up reply actions
Feeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeever dog...
scratchin at my back door
"I am excited about starting 2009. We are looking forward to an outstanding year. We're on our way. We have a lot of healthy players this year." - Vinny Cerrato
Stillwater: a great band
If only they could have stayed together, personally I think it was the media’s fault for bringing them down. After the cover of the Rolling Stones, and what was said it all feel apart. Well not all, families did get back together…
No one would be complaining about all the veterans we are acquiring
if we had an O-line. That’s pretty much all we have to do to completely “rebuild”. Get an O line and we are a playoff contender with a few needs or holes like any other team. I say we go for it all by drafting Okung at 4, then trading back into the top 10 using a combination of our future picks and trade bait (hyanesworth, landry, etc.) and select Trent Williams or the other Tackle out of Iowa. Then we would only need a RG, but we can find an adequate veteran one. Sounds like a good quick fix that sets us up for the long term.
Kids in the backseat cause accidents, Accidents in the backseat cause kids.
The thing about Redskins fans is we always complain...
Even behind the Hogs I’d still have problems with the current backfield.
"I am excited about starting 2009. We are looking forward to an outstanding year. We're on our way. We have a lot of healthy players this year." - Vinny Cerrato
And.....
unproven receiving core, FS issues, undersize MLBs, disgruntled or injured NT, undersized ends. Did I miss anyone?
a general lack of depth
especially at LB
SpottieOttieDopaliscious
sucky kicking game...missed that one
The world looks mighty different when you're peeking out your belly button
by Skins Fan '77 on Apr 8, 2010 6:35 PM EDT up reply actions
we can live with all the other stuff we currently have
I’m saying doing that would make us instantly competative and on par with all the playoff contending teams.
Kids in the backseat cause accidents, Accidents in the backseat cause kids.
by Area 51 Forever on Apr 8, 2010 11:09 PM EDT up reply actions
mcnabb will make WR corp better, we still had a good D without a FS even on the roster and we can find someone other than landry who can be decent. We don’t need a NT and our MLBs aren’t undersized as long as we stick to the 4-3 and not the retarded 3-4. Our ends aren’t undersized for the 4-3 but definetly are if we switch to the retarded 3-4. Basically I’m saying that we can live with everything else we have for now and if we find a way to fix our offensive line now for the long term then we will be instantly competative and on par with playoff contending teams so we won’t have to go through a long “rebuilding” period and just go straight into contending for a playoff spot or more. Those other holes we have will definetly tried to be filled or improved later, but if we fix the O line we won’t be “rebuilding” anymore but we will be like any other competative playoffs seeking team with a few holes but nothing major.
Kids in the backseat cause accidents, Accidents in the backseat cause kids.
by Area 51 Forever on Apr 8, 2010 11:13 PM EDT up reply actions
but i mean its something we can live with
we won’t be “rebuilding” if we fix the O line, but we will be a playoff contending team that has a few holes like anyone else.
Kids in the backseat cause accidents, Accidents in the backseat cause kids.
by Area 51 Forever on Apr 8, 2010 11:14 PM EDT up reply actions
If we don't recoup a bunch of picks via trading away players
we have no resources to rebuild the OL
"By far the worst performers on the team are in the front office." – Sally Jenkins
+1
I think you and I are the only ones who get this. Many people here seem to think we’ll have capable starters from 4th round picks or UDFAs.
OH, but they’ll be “good value”, so where’s the problem? Geeze
The world looks mighty different when you're peeking out your belly button
by Skins Fan '77 on Apr 9, 2010 11:16 AM EDT up reply actions
Are you kidding me that what I said above
we gotta trade back into the first round or second round so we can get another bookend tackle to be our starting RT opposite Okung and then we use competition/shrewd veteran signing to find an adequate starter at RG and our O line is fixed.
Kids in the backseat cause accidents, Accidents in the backseat cause kids.
by Area 51 Forever on Apr 11, 2010 6:45 PM EDT up reply actions
Unicorns for everyone!
we gotta trade back into the first round or second round so we can get another bookend tackle to be our starting RT opposite Okung and then we use competition/shrewd veteran signing to find an adequate starter at RG and our O line is fixed.
"By far the worst performers on the team are in the front office." – Sally Jenkins
Did you even read what I previously posted?
that’s exactly what I proposed! Trading back into the first round to get another bookend tackle other than Okung.
Kids in the backseat cause accidents, Accidents in the backseat cause kids.
by Area 51 Forever on Apr 11, 2010 6:44 PM EDT up reply actions
It's true. If were addressing our biggest, most debilitating need, these other moves would be ok.
That’s what I always say: some of the moves Snyder & Co make wouldn’t be bad for a playoff team, but for a rebuilding team they’re a complete waste of resources.
then trading back into the top 10 using a combination of our future picks and trade bait (hyanesworth, landry, etc.) and select Trent Williams or the other Tackle out of Iowa.
Disagree with this, we need to take another OL in the 2nd or 3rd (or BOTH! if we had ’em) because there are still good prospects but the financial commitment is much less.
That’s why I value 2nd rounders so much, and am so mad about the McNabb trade, or the drafting of THREE pass catchers 2 years ago.
You can do so much with 2nd rounders (in terms of value), and we do so little.
"By far the worst performers on the team are in the front office." – Sally Jenkins
Yeah
2nd rounders are like red Skittles….they are not just my favorite tasting Skittles, but they make any other skittle taste better if you pair it with a red. When I see a red Skittle, I am happy and excited because, you know…I got that red Skittle in the ol’ hopper.
by Ken Meringolo on Apr 8, 2010 5:19 PM EDT up reply actions
Excellent post
except reds are the best.
"By far the worst performers on the team are in the front office." – Sally Jenkins
Nuetrality and Balance
A mixture of both youth and experience is what’s needed. But, if the experience out- weighs the immediate upside and/or impact of the youth, then you have to go with experience. For example: If the Redskins didn’t move for McNabb, then they are left with starting Campbell, again. Or, worse yet, drafting one of the available QB in the draft, after Sam Bradford. Two scenarios I am not comfortable with. It takes 2-4 years before most QB are ready to play every game. I don’t think I can handle much more of the offense that I’ve seen from the Skins with Campbell at ‘The Helm’. A position he has yet to prove he is mentaly capable of playing. Maybe McNabb can help both Campbell and Grossman become better players, only time will tell.
You failed to mention how Tom Brady would look awful behind Levi Jones & Stephen Heyer.
"By far the worst performers on the team are in the front office." – Sally Jenkins
But this brings it back to the blame it all on Campbell, all we need is one QB
nonsense.
Everyone here knows or should know that I’m a Campbell apologist to a degree. I don’t get what is so bad about starting Campbell on a rebuilding team.
nor do I
but we’re not rebuilding evidently
The world looks mighty different when you're peeking out your belly button
by Skins Fan '77 on Apr 8, 2010 6:38 PM EDT up reply actions
No matter what they say...
Football teams are always rebuilding, whether it’s their starters, or their bench.
by Scorin' Scalps on Apr 8, 2010 6:45 PM EDT up reply actions
We need way more than one anything.
I’m not a Campbell hater, and I’m sure not blaming him for the Redskin’s woes. I’m just saying that the current QB draft class is slightly overrated. Either way, Campbell isn’t as capable a QB as McNabb, and Campbell may be able to learn a few things from a veteran with a similar style. I’m not ready to run Campbell off, but I don’t want the ball in his hands until he learns how to be a little more decisive.
by Scorin' Scalps on Apr 8, 2010 6:43 PM EDT up reply actions
The cost for McNabb was too high though.
We desperately needed that 2nd.
"By far the worst performers on the team are in the front office." – Sally Jenkins
+100
An offense doesn’t exist without an offensive line. At this point, without Samuels, and potentially drafting another young QB with pick #4, we still haven’t done anything to improve that O-line. Secondly, McNabb is no longer putting up top 10 QB stats. We already had a middle of the pack QB in Campbell. It was our O-line that was ranked nearly dead last in the league last year by most sites. So, we have the most room for improvement at a position that we have done relatively nothing to improve. Terrific! Good luck McNabb. Everybody seems to be expecting greatness from you McNabb, but I know better. With this O-line mediocrity will be good enough for me.
We have had luck in the draft...
In the past when Joe Gibbs first go round found some sleepers in late rounds (Monte Coleman, Daryl Grant and some of the original hogs. This article is basicly about George Allen (1) not waiting or having patience for rookies. Joe Theisman waited several years before becoming full time starter. Joe Gibbs found a balance of both and got lucky in the draft and made Redskin legacy two from 1980 to about 1993. We are still waiting for legacy number three to be sucessfull, it is obvious at some point we need to get a star O-Lineman to build around since being drafting in the top ten means that your team is not capable of competing against others in the most important aspect of the game (running and passing) for reasons of age and injuries. Winning again will move us down the draft board which is better since we could have ability to fill needs for that year. Of course it could blow up if you select the wrong players and not have any luck in finding sleepers late in the draft. All in all the McNab trade looks good ffor us but Philly is breathing prettie good with what they have. I think we have the right coach to get the Redskins back in the saddle since our D looks good, we just need to score some points this year and get more turnovers from our D side of the ball.
aka 'get an offensive line'
we just need to score some points
"By far the worst performers on the team are in the front office." – Sally Jenkins
Heck yeh, score some points.
I would like the Skins to average more than 17 points a game, again. Shanahan and McNabb may not be “spring chickens”, but they know how to score points and win games.
I'm not drinking this cool aid
The mentality to win now almost never works but it does consistently producers losing teams.
But if you allowed yourself a sip.....
I am not a fan of this washed up veteran mentality, but if you can see some, albeit limited success in the short term while building through the draft with the picks you have and allow those vets to help in the molding process, what’s the harm? I hate like poison the idea of taking a QB in the first round, but there are QB’s available later that could be worthwhile. Zac Robinson, Jonathon Crompton, that Kafka kid and that kid from Cincy – Pike (it was NOT HIS THROWING ARM that he broke) are all worthwhile draft subjects if they 1.) fit the system and 2.) Danny doesn’t fire Shanahan in the first 6 weeks, therefore allowing the system to play out over several years. Trade down the 1st round pick for more picks if Okung is gone, and draft the future – like two to three years future… Bringing on vets is indeed shrewd if there is a bigger and much prettier picture in the works.
what picks?
while building through the draft with the picks
"By far the worst performers on the team are in the front office." – Sally Jenkins
well........
Ya, it’s limited now, but I was assuming (yes I know the breakdown of the word assume) that the possibility of trading JC could net at least a third round pick this year plus a provisional pick next year. There are a few more tenders out there that could land a 3rd or 4th round pick as well. I’m hoping that the only real D help that the draft will have to address is later round depth, but FA could also give some depth there. If 70% of our picks go towards O-line depth, I think we’re heading in the right direction with a good mix of future starters (they don’t all have to go to the pro bowl) and decent backups. After all, when was the last time we went into a draft specifically focusing on o-line issues and take it seriously? This flowery draft agenda also assumes that Thomas and Kelly are serviceable, the addition of Parker and Johnson add a year or two to Portis (stop laughing!!) and that we do grab a good system QB this year.
I like you
while mentioning your trade scenarios, you admit that it’s not some far gone conclusion that these things will happen. a lot different than what’s been floating around lately….despite the fact that your a pens fan :D
SpottieOttieDopaliscious
Like most 'skins fans
I have gone from unconditional faith to blind hope to guarded optimism to conventional realism to a bipolar disgust / emotional optimism when it comes to our drafting and seasonal performance. The only reason I feel compelled NOW to discuss any reasonable draft strategy is due to Shanny and Allen. Let’s hope I don’t add “sombre day of suck” to my stages of draft day emotion.
Given the Pens / Caps history going back to when Sid and Ovie were still in kindergarten (or whatever they call it in Russia and Nova Scotia) I can understand and fully endorse the obligatory jabs – I would be very disappointed if I didn’t get some grief over it!
Never heard a more accurate description
of most skins fans’ state of mind.
have gone from unconditional faith to blind hope to guarded optimism to conventional realism to a bipolar disgust / emotional optimism
SpottieOttieDopaliscious
IF we recoup picks, it's possible
IF.
"By far the worst performers on the team are in the front office." – Sally Jenkins
I think Shanny was willing to part with those picks
cuz he thinks he can get some mid to late round draft picks for some vets on Draft day.
by BayAreaBullet on Apr 9, 2010 12:34 PM EDT up reply actions
that's certainly a best-case explanation
"By far the worst performers on the team are in the front office." – Sally Jenkins
lol. I know a Redskins/Pens fan
"By far the worst performers on the team are in the front office." – Sally Jenkins
George Allen had a knack for
picking the right vets
and getting the most out of them
He’s always open. He catches a lot of balls. He’s un-guardable, no matter how old he is
While that is true...
and I am pretty confident that Shanny knows what he is doing and can get these guy to produce to the best of their ability, that was a different football era. Due to modern training schedules/facilities plus supplements (legal or otherwise) the atheleticism is at such a high level it is just more difficult for players at many positions to continue to perform at the level necessary to compete later in their careers.
Well said
When George Allen was getting players it was about pure size and strength. The game has evolved today into a game of speed and athleticism. Younger guys are generally faster and more athletic across the board, with perhaps a few exceptions. In addition, injuries are more frequent and lasting in older players. However, vets are smarter. Ideally, I’d like to have one vet at MLB, one vet at FS or SS, and vets at QB and C to keep everybody aware of their assignments and to provide a basic level of stability on the field. I prefer to have young athletic talent at most of the other positions. I agree with the sentiment, that I would feel much more comfortable with the Eagles young team (average age 24) and 20 picks in the next two drafts. That’s a winning formula for the next 5-10 years. It also allows them to take risks in the draft, as they can afford some flops with 20 picks. Additionally, they can package those any number of ways to position themselves to get the guys they need/want in the draft. I think the track record speaks volumes when you compare the two teams over the last decade.
On the bright side, the Eagles can’t possibly have enough roster space for all those picks, so maybe we can get some of those Eagle draft picks when the Eagles are forced to cut some of them.

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