A 4-12 team has magically become an 8-8 team?

by dr WNC on Apr 27, 2010 7:56 AM EDT

Redskins under the direction of new Head Coach Mike Shanahan and GM Bruce Allen have used the off-season to change the team from a 4-12 team to an 8-8 team, and this has been accomplished with specific and strategic moves not the :"flashy" signings of the years past

via abritishman.files.wordpress.com

The draft additions and the moves this off-season were to make a team better; to make a 4-12 team magically become an 8-8 team. How long have teams like Oakland, Detroit, St. Louis and yes the Redskins struggled year-in and year-out to improve with huge changes to the coaching staffs or big name signings only to see a "blip" good year followed by another poor year or several poor years. A team which can go on a 6-2 run only to collapse in the second half to finish 8-8 and then make the biggest FA defensive signing and end up going 4-12 the next year.

The difference is the decisions being made by coaches and the front office the idea of just adding players versus building a team. For the first time in Owner Daniel Snyder's history the Redskins are being run by football people in both the Coaching and GM role and it appears they are doing it right by building a team instead of trying to become instant winners. Transforming a 4-12 team to an 8-8 team does make it a "non-rebuilding" year. An 8-8 team can "catch a genie in a bottle" and make a serious run at something special or they can finish 8-8 with the future looking bright with a few additions we as fans can see the improvement and competitiveness of a well run team, not just a bunch of players

As Hall recently stated via the DC sports Bog

"It's based on the talent we feel like we've got," he said. "It's based on the improvements I feel like we've made. It's based on the scheme. The scheme alone is gonna give us four or five more wins. The games we lost by two, three points, we'll win those games, easy.

Better O-Line check

QB with a Quicker release Check

QB Better at reading defenses Check

An aggressive Defense Check

Coaches might not play the games but coaches decisions have a lot to do with wins and losses.

The Redskins still have "holes" but the Redskins are no longer a 4-12 team they are an 8-8 team which will become a dominate team when all the areas are addressed, I guess it goes to show you "Rome was not built in a day" and the Redskins could not address every issue in one off-season but the did magic to make a 4-12 team an 8-8 team HTTR!

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Comments

I'm drinking the Koolaide

but until the wins are in the bag, I’m not counting them. Then again, the fact that it is obvious they have a plan and it appears that most are buying into it is comforting.

Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana.

by Scott E on Apr 27, 2010 8:38 AM EDT reply actions

+1

by SSBlitz on Apr 27, 2010 9:14 AM EDT up reply actions

Of course, I think we all thought they’d be about 8-8 last year, too.

"There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics." -Mark Twain (?)

by elesias on Apr 27, 2010 8:45 AM EDT reply actions

No, they had "playoff caliber players"

according to Vinny.

Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana.

by Scott E on Apr 27, 2010 11:00 AM EDT up reply actions

What we're really going to find out this season

I think what we’re going to find out is how much better Shanahan’s coaching staff was than Zorns and I think it’s going to be a huge difference. We all know we could have easily won 3 or 4 more games last year with better coaching and now we have a better team (better players). Even with a tough schedule I think we’ll be a team nobody wants to play.

by aFan4Life on Apr 27, 2010 9:05 AM EDT reply actions

I think it's the same deal last year

If we stay healthy we’re an 8-8 team….but every team hits injuries…so I still think 8-8 is our ceiling…ie – no playoffs.

Hogs Haven. On Twitter. And Facebook.

by Kevin Ewoldt on Apr 27, 2010 9:42 AM EDT reply actions

We are two games better

without Suisham. And I seem to recall that McNabb has a good history of 4th Qtr comebacks. We will be much better all around – but we will be measured against some of the elite teams in the league, not last years doormats.

Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana.

by Scott E on Apr 27, 2010 11:02 AM EDT reply actions

I think a lot of people are underestimating the value of good coaching, and discipline versus the complete opposite.

Jim Zorn was a weak pansy of a coach. He would have been hard for me to play for because he does not command respect or accountability from his player. Mike Shanahan is a man’s, man, even if you don’t like Shanahan he commands respect on the team. Lets go “Iron Mike Shanahan.”

by LETJASONPASS on Apr 27, 2010 11:06 AM EDT reply actions

I wouldn't let you play for my flag football team.

He [Zorn} would have been hard for me to play for

by DoWork on Apr 27, 2010 11:21 AM EDT up reply actions

I'd be careful Do

LJP is really Dave Butz

by Tiller56 on Apr 27, 2010 9:29 PM EDT up reply actions

say it ain't so, Tiller

by MagicHat on Apr 28, 2010 6:25 AM EDT up reply actions

We just need to stay the course

Marty had us going in the right direction before Dan and Vinny screwed it up.
Gibbs was even making some progress until Dan and Vinny struck again.
I will not feel comfortable until Vinny is completely out of the picture and Danny is only seen at Super Bowls.

LJP- thank you for formatting that comment above , it is so much easier to read and comprehend that way………..thanks!

The world looks mighty different when you're peeking out your belly button

by Skins Fan '77 on Apr 27, 2010 11:21 AM EDT reply actions

I wouldn't say Gibbs was "making progress"...

Yes, we backed into the playoffs once and snuck in after we white-knuckled it down the stretch for the other trip, but man did JJG make some stupid decisions during that time.

Let’s start with the whole Ramsey debacle. Could he have been our franchise QB? I don’t know, because Spurrier refused to protect him because he wanted to get noted speedsters Rod Gardner and Chris Doering in on the same package. Gibbs showed no love for him either despite Brunell clearly being hurt/old in Gibbs’ first year back.

So we traded three(!) picks to Denver for the right to draft JC. Those picks turned into:

1) 3rd Round in ’05, 76 overall – K. Paymah, 60 gm at CB w/Denver, now w/SF
2) 1st Round in ’06, 22 overall (traded to SF) – M. Lawson, starting at LB for SF
3) 4th Round in ’06, 119 overall – Brandon Fucking Marshall.

Ok…so not so good. They reached for a guy by giving up three picks that turned into some pretty good talent.

Moving right along: AREl, Brandon Lloyd, Archuleta, and ACarter. One of the four is currently on the roster. None of them have been worth their sizable contracts and the associated cap hits.
That fall (06) we traded a third round pick to Denver as part of the three-team deal that netted us TJ Duckket.

Adding insult to injury, Gibbs and Vinny decided that we had a need at Safety in 2007 (all of this before we lost ST), so we drafted LaRon Landry at #6 overall in 2007. Taken one spot later by the Vikings, one Adrian Peterson.

I’m not even going to get into the trade for CP, the contract to Betts, or the move for Brunell.

Gibbs fucked this team. Sure, Vinny and Danny were happy to help. But Gibbs royally fucked this team, and I have a hard time forgetting that.

by TerroristFistJab on Apr 27, 2010 5:14 PM EDT up reply actions

yes!!!!!!!

everybody on here praised his second coming. however, shan and allen are better then gibbs and cerrato. gibbs had an outdated offense scheme as well…it worked in KC though!? gregg williams saved us.

by back_to_the_future on Apr 27, 2010 5:26 PM EDT up reply actions

you have not considered the anchor that Vinny represents fully.

The team was screwed royally by Spurrier and Cerrato , much as it was by Zorn and Cerrato.
Gibbs started us back down the right road inspite of Cerrato, he just couldn’t finish the job.
ST 21s death took alot out of him.
We made some mistakes, but 2 post seasons in 4 aint bad coming from 5-11 post Spurrier.
Let’s see if Shanahan can do as well.
Greg Williams, Portis, Cooley, Taylor, Sellers, Moss, Fletcher all came here on Gibbs watch.

The world looks mighty different when you're peeking out your belly button

by Skins Fan '77 on Apr 27, 2010 8:34 PM EDT up reply actions

You mean to tell me...

That Joe Jackson Gibbs had less pull than Vinny? Please.

2 postseasons is nice, but look at what we sold of our future to get those two weak appearances. Gibbs sold us down the river because he, Vinny, and Danny don’t actually know how to build football teams in the modern era.

Not only did Joe leave us high and dry, he clearly didn’t teach Danny anything, for the second a big-time guy was available we had an offer in place at 12:01 am on the first day of FA. Of course now we’re trying to dump that guy after paying him $34 million in bonus money.

by TerroristFistJab on Apr 27, 2010 11:06 PM EDT up reply actions

the difference between Gibbs 1.0 and 2.0

Beatherd/Casserly vs Cerrato
Gibbs never mortgaged the future before, why this time?
because ownership and FO made it so.
Heck, almost every decent player on the roster is here because of Gibbs, how can you say he stripped the team? Cerrato did that, alot of it after Gibbs left

The world looks mighty different when you're peeking out your belly button

by Skins Fan '77 on Apr 28, 2010 11:00 AM EDT up reply actions

and you can't teach Snyder anything

already been proven, too arrogant

The world looks mighty different when you're peeking out your belly button

by Skins Fan '77 on Apr 28, 2010 11:02 AM EDT up reply actions

Well I'll give you...

that Danny doesn’t learn.

But Gibbs couldn’t mortgage the future in the past because he never had a cap to worry about. It’s ok to make a multi-million dollar mistake if it doesn’t prevent you from signing a better player.

I’d love to have been a fly on the wall on all of Vinny’s pre-draft meetings with the coaching staff and ownership. You’d think that after a while, they’d just realize they sucked at coming up with a strategy and would have just copied what the successful teams were doing (ie stocking up on mid-round picks and building along the lines).

by TerroristFistJab on Apr 28, 2010 11:26 AM EDT up reply actions

Gibbs has always relied heavily on the FO

thats why leaving Vinny was such a mistake. Gibbs has never claimed to be a Holmgren, Parcells or Shanahan type coach, he needs help with personell decisions.
Now who’s fault is it that Gibbs was teamed with Cerrato? Allen would not have been any better with Gibbs. You need a GM like Pioli, Young or Casserly to go with a coach like Gibbs.

The world looks mighty different when you're peeking out your belly button

by Skins Fan '77 on Apr 28, 2010 12:04 PM EDT up reply actions

Remember

Shanahan had one of the most epic collapses his last time out there, blowing a 3 game lead with 3 games to play. This is a “what have you done for me lately” league, and what I’m seeing is a big fat choke job.

Of course he’s better than Zorn ever was, but that’s not saying much. I would suggest that we not look at the Elway Shanahan and look at his last few years of work: 9-7, 7-9, 8-8. Not much better than what we had under Gibbs II.

In other words, let’s not get our hopes up just yet.

by killianskid34 on Apr 27, 2010 12:42 PM EDT reply actions

Don't forget he has had some extensive time recharging, rejuvenating

and ostensibly learning from the past. I think he is the perfect guy for the job at this time now that he’s had a year off, so I’m drinking the Koolaide.

Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana.

by Scott E on Apr 27, 2010 2:48 PM EDT up reply actions

Our problem last year..

and even years before with Gibbs is we always got to conservative once we had a lead. We would elect to run the ball and not put the ball in the hands of JC to finish the other team off. I watched to many games where we would pray for the defense to hold our lead in the 4th. Just to put it simple, you have to stay aggresive for 4 quarters that is how you win games. If we did that last year we would have easily been 8-8.

by Devinsgoingdeep on Apr 27, 2010 3:13 PM EDT reply actions

Last year we had 5 games against legitimately cake opponents

and yet we still went 4-12.

This year our schedule only has 3 cake opponents, so its going to be a tougher slog, even if our team has improved

My doublestuffed oreos fell on the floor of my mom's basement. Save me swagman!

by SomebodyBuyAustinaSteak on Apr 27, 2010 3:22 PM EDT reply actions

Personally, I don’t think they were “a 4-12 team” last year. I know that’s what their record says they were, but when I think of the 5 to 10 worst teams in the league, I wouldn’t have thought the Redskins. It should be a major disappointment if their record isn’t drastically better.

by JimmyK on Apr 27, 2010 4:30 PM EDT reply actions

While not the best team

Ever, I think we have moved in a good direction, here’s to 8-8.

I am a bear of very little brains and big words bother me.

by Topher Doll on Apr 27, 2010 5:40 PM EDT reply actions

8-8 or 10-6

I can’t argue with the 8-8, but think there’s a significant chance it will be better than that – 9-7 or 10-6, and a smaller chance that it will be worse, like 7-9. When I go down the schedule I figure about 7 likely wins (3 in div, Jax, Det, Stl, TB), about 5 losses (3 in div, Indy, Minn), and 4 games I rate as close – say even, + or – one point (Houston, GB, at Bears and Tenn). Lot of assumptions there: we adequately fill RT, and Trent and Donovan stay healthy, and there is no other major wave of injuries, the 3-4 defense doesn’t hurt much. I think last year as an aberration – the Skins were much better than a 4-12 team normally is – probably more like 8-8 (middle of the pack) in overall strength.

by Donnio1234 on Apr 27, 2010 5:53 PM EDT reply actions