Realistic Look at the Rex Grossman Situation
It definitely marks the end of Colt and possibly Campbell.
almost 2 years ago
Kevin Ewoldt
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I hope this really means
no QB drafted in the 1st round.
Not really
Shanahan likely has these early workouts to see if Campbell can handle this system…they need to know sooner rather than later….he’s in yet another trial period as I see it.
"I am excited about starting 2009. We are looking forward to an outstanding year. We're on our way. We have a lot of healthy players this year." - Vinny Cerrato
by Kevin Ewoldt on Mar 17, 2010 11:59 AM EDT up reply actions
I like the Grossman signing.
Bringing in a quality, experienced back-up with knowledge of the system is sensible and smart.
He is a quality back-up QB, not a starter.
His starting days are over, other than a spot start for injury or caretaker role. He has started 35 games including 3 playoff games and a Super Bowl. It’s an upgrade at the back-up QB position. Plus he knows Kyle’s system, and should help the other QBs with his experience and knowledge. He has a big arm and can stretch the field with his deep passing ability.
He is only going to be 30 so he could be around for a while.
if by quality you mean
3 of 9, 1 interception last year.
by RobtheRedskin on Mar 19, 2010 11:13 AM EDT up reply actions
I don't think its a big deal for Campbell
Shanahan wants competition at every position, and I think Grossman will serve to push Campbell a little bit, but Campbell will keep the starting spot.
What I do think this means is that we won’t be drafting a QB in the 1st or 2nd round.
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Don't see how Grossman spells the end for Campbell
First of all, this guy is making the assumption that it’s a near-certainty that the Redskins will draft a QB. I still think the most likely (and smartest) pick is an OL. Second, he assumes that Grossman being signed to a low-cost, one-year contract somehow guarantees that Grossman won’t get cut. He seems to think that at the end of the summer the Redskins will part ways with Campbell, but neglects the fact that Campbell is better than Grossman (by far). Yes, Campbell has trade value, but he also has field value. For me, if I’ve got a Sam Bradford being coached to take over the franchise some day soon, and I need an experienced QB there to buffer until the kid’s ready, why would I ever take Grossman over Jason Campbell? Besides, a starting QB carries the kind of trade value that most teams aren’t willing to pay. How many teams really want to give up a second-round pick? It doesn’t matter what you get out of it, high draft picks are important. Other than that, you probably have to give up two starters at other positions for a starting QB.
If the Redskins draft a QB, then yes, that does mark the end of Campbell’s time here, but he’ll probably still be around this season. But signing a washed-up QB does not have the same effect.
I agree
I think if we draft a QB rd 1 then it will be the end of Campbell but I don’t know that this says anything definitive. If anything I’d say it means that they have no confidence in Brennan (surprise, surprise, I won’t even ask where the Colt Cult evaporated to) and need someone they feel they can at least put in should an emergency arise since they cut Collins.
by SkinsOsTerps on Mar 17, 2010 12:38 PM EDT up reply actions
Systems
I think it has a lot to do with systems. Collins was brought in here because he was familiar with Al Saunders’ system. Collins was too old to be a reliable Grossman is being brought in here because he is familiar with Kyle Shanahan’s system. I don’t think it’s a stretch to imagine that Grossman is being brought in to A) run the Shanahan offense, and B) to groom a replacement that was drafted in the first round. To me, I read this as the end of Campbell.
by killianskid34 on Mar 17, 2010 1:19 PM EDT up reply actions
?
You’re forgetting the fact that we needed a backup QB. This is simply signing a guy to be our #2, a guy who, as you say, knows (somewhat) the system we’re using here. Keep in mind, though, that this guy has only been in the Shanahan system since last June — that’s a mere 9 months. It’s not as if he’s got a vast amount of knowledge in the system and could become a mentor/coach to the young kid.
And there’s still the assumption being made that a QB will be drafted. Having a backup at every position, especially QB, is a necessity in the NFL. So how is that when we sign a backup QB, that means that our starter is out? Why would we get rid of one QB only so that we can show the other one the door when we have a shortage of QBs?
With Collins off the roster
the Skins needed a experienced backup. No matter whether Grossman was only in the young Shanny’s system for only a season. It is not like there is a super abundance of free agent quarterbacks to pick from either. It does look like the hand writing is on the wall for Colt B.
by Jefferson1935 on Mar 17, 2010 2:01 PM EDT up reply actions
I understand that completely
I’m just trying to figure out how signing a backup means that you’re going to cut your starter.
I see your point but if that happens
I think we have to conclude that the new management is straight up awful. I mean, say either your A or B is the case. What do we do with Campbell? Just let him walk to another team without even getting a high draft pick for him?
by SkinsOsTerps on Mar 17, 2010 1:59 PM EDT up reply actions
while it would be a curious move
and no doubt raise the blood pressure on a lot of Skins fans, I still contend that we need to let the Shanaplan play out for AT LEAST one full season before passing judgement. The only coach we’ve had with RECENT NFL success since Gibbs pt. 1 was Marty, and we didn’t give him a chance to finish his “rebuilding plan.” Shouldn’t we learn something from that?
Nice blanket for the pre-mature fire
Getting ready for next season is a convoluted and lengthy process. Analyzing every hint of a step along the way and trying to play it out to some logical conclusion is the equivalent of the Blind Men and the Elephant parable. Yes, some of the things I’ve observed are a bit disturbing, but like you say, it’s up to us to wait and evaluate once the entire picture is presented on the field next year.
Of course, all this speculation IS fun!
Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana.
Don't know much about Grossman so .....
How about one of our research aces digging up two or three PROFESSIONAL appraisals of Grossman’s abilitys. EG: Can he throw long? Accurate? Can he run/evade? Think? Communicate? Get along in the locker-room?
He can think
He is, therefore he thinks. I’m pretty sure he can communicate as well. Can he do either of those things to proper effect? I doubt it. He might be able to get along in the locker room. I mean, why not? It’s not like he’s a threat to anyone’s job.
Bears fan here
…and obviously not a professional but I’ve sure seen a lot of him.
Grossman is somewhat of an enigma. I don’t think he’s an ideal backup like Collins was. This isn’t some low-risk, reliable old guy who’ll turn in a forgettable, slightly-above-replacement-level performance. He’s a failed prospect who was once considered to have a very high upside.
He can make some of the most beautiful throws you’ve ever seen, especially 10-15+ yards downfield. He was excellent at play action, and also should be good out of the shotgun (although he’s never got much of a chance at that in the pros). He is tough and also seems to be a genuinely nice guy who gets along with his teammates.
I don’t know what else he is good at. He will sometimes follow up one of those beautiful, uncannily accurate throws with a bullet right between a DB’s numbers. He is short, immobile, locks on to receivers, and is famous for making questionable decisions. I don’t know much about Shanahan’s system or how well he fits. Imagine Jake Plummer but half a foot shorter, less athletic, and a little better at throwing it deep.
In Chicago, he had an aging, overrated OL and a truly retarded offensive coordinator—but he also had a great running game and defense. Giving him the benefit of the doubt, I think he could succeed as an NFL starter with good pass blocking. He’ll probably never get a chance though.
I don’t think Grossman is very good, but he probably doesn’t deserve to get made fun of so much.
by James Todd Smith on Mar 17, 2010 2:14 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Thanks James
for your input. Gives me a much better feel for the guy.
sounds a lot like Campbell
. He was excellent at play action, and also should be good out of the shotgun
Pommylee
LL
I didn’t know you were a Bears fan? I thought you were New York all the way. My Bad. I guess the Bears Need Love too. That’s alright though, I’m the Type of Guy who doesn’t judge. So, anyway, when I first heard on My Radio that they were signing Grossman, it Rocked My Bells. But then I realized that I needed to keep the faith, so I said to myself Stand By Your Man, and decided to let trust in Shanny.
Seriously though, Shanahan isn’t dumb. He’s not bringing Grossman in to start. Grossman is obviously the best option on the market as a backup QB who knows the system and could come in a game and not be overwhelmed. I also think that if, by some long shot, Brennan outshines him in training camp, then Rex would be either relegated to 3rd string, or cut. It’s not like Grossman has teams knocking down his door offering opportunities. I thin he knows the deal here.
Yeah, I was doin’ it in Queens for a while, but now you can catch me around the way in the Chi.
Well for all his limitations, I take Grossman seriously as an NFL QB. That’s more than I can say for Colt Brennan or any number of freakishly horrible QB ideas around the league in recent history (JaMarcus Russell, Derek Anderson, Tarvaris Jackson, Mike Vick, maybe Tim Tebow in 2010??) RG is probably better than quite a few starters teams throw out there regularly. Better than Kyle Orton, I can tell you that. Much better than broken-down washouts like Chad Pennington on his third arm or Daunte Culpepper on a wooden leg. I don’t think he’s worse than Campbell. Watch film of him vs. Seattle and New Orleans in the playoffs during the superbowl year before you pass judgment. You’ll see a flawed but definitely competent pro who is actually better at some things than most of his peers. Grossman is probably underrated and the Skins got a good deal. You have to think something must go horribly wrong, though, for Grossman to start many games.
As for Shanny, I think you trust him to make a good offensive system and run a good organization. You don’t trust him to make great personnel moves. I’m sure this has been hashed out over and over on this board, but remember Brian Griese? Dale Carter? Maurice Clarett? That’s what you hired Allen for, right? I mean, Shanahan has made good moves too, of course. But he’s not a miracle worker, especially without Alex Gibbs to coach the OL. If Shanahan/Allen somehow wrest a stable, rational organization from the grip of your maniac owner, you should be happy whether or not you win much right away.
by James Todd Smith on Mar 18, 2010 1:19 PM EDT up reply actions
The end of Campbell
If JC is replaced by RG then you may start to hear the call back for Vinny Cerrato. That’s how dumb that move would be. Instead It’s just going to be some real competition for JC, something he’s NEVER had since he’s took over the starting job. Colt Brennan and Todd Collins were never a threat to take his job, this is what Shanny has taken notice to and it’s a good thing.
It’s another locker room and off the field idiot like Porter that would really suprise me if he gets signed. Besides, Porter is not young at all, when the season starts he’ll be 33. If you are going to mention London fletcher as an example, I don’t think you can compare anyone to Fletcher, he’s the exception not the norm and I find it hard to believe we could get so lucky again.
by skinsymets on Mar 17, 2010 12:50 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
Nice post
and aptly stated. You happen to be correct as well. JC will start next year and we will move forward into greatness. HTTR!
Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana.
it's just as likely
good bye to Colt who really hasn’t impressed anyone since college. He had his chances in pre season and did nothing so why keep him?
But where will all the Colt zombies go?
:(
"By far the worst performers on the team are in the front office." – Sally Jenkins
Clausen!
"I am excited about starting 2009. We are looking forward to an outstanding year. We're on our way. We have a lot of healthy players this year." - Vinny Cerrato
by Kevin Ewoldt on Mar 17, 2010 2:57 PM EDT up reply actions
Colt Brennan
Not sure if its true, but there seems to be two strikes against Brennan. His mechanics are in question and this hip injury maybe more serious than we know
by Nova Warrior on Mar 17, 2010 3:38 PM EDT up reply actions
They'll just quietly assimilate with the legions
of Obamatrons as they latch onto another figure to blindly worship.
This writer just went from point A to point Q
We had one QB on the team who has ever played in the NFL. Our only other QB has only played in the preseason and just spent a year on the IR. So we signed a backup QB, and therefore we’re going to have Sam Bradford as our starter next year, right after we cut Jason Campbell. But I understand why he wrote all of this. I happen to have a reliable source telling me what is on the floor of this writer’s office:
yes, yes, it is a horrible idea
to quote Samir.
This has everything to do with acquiring a backup that knows the system, as previously stated. If Campbell gets hurt, I’d feel more comfortable with an experienced bumbling idiot than a rookie bumbling idiot. It makes me wonder if the management does indeed feel we’re only a few small pieces parts from mediocrity, and mediocrity can sneak you into the playoffs sometimes. Or are we just plugging roster spots with old guys so that their replacements will be well-tutored when it’s their time to take over in 1-2 years.
I guess we’ll have a better idea of this if Joey Porter is indeed signed.
Nicely quoted
I think the vet signings are basically holes being plugged while the team legitimately builds for the future. Maybe we can get into the playoffs this year (like you said, sneak in), but there is no “all in” mentality around here. Older guys are being signed for very little guaranteed money; draft picks aren’t being given up; and money is being saved. It really does seem like this team is working to build itself up over a series of years. Perpetual Super Bowl contenders become that way because they spend the proper amount of time building up a roster according to system, needs, and team unity. The Saints won a Super Bowl with a bunch of their own players, many of them late-round draft picks who were passed up by other teams. The Saints always pick up players who fit the bill of the type of team they are building; they don’t go the route of getting the best available free agent or draftee. It looks like we’re starting to do that, too. But for the time being, we’ve got to fill up the roster somehow. May as well do it on the cheap.
I don't see this as the end of Campbell or Brennan.
Not on its own, in any case.
Grossman replaces Collins (younger in the same position). Colt was out all last year, and could still be number 3 (depending on what the new coaching staff thinks of him).
The real answers will come in the draft. If (and a big if) we draft a QB (in any round) it may spell (long or short term) the end of Campbell (early round) or Colt (late round). Otherwise, if they do as I hope and answer other questions with the draft, then maybe we have a workable QB corps and we can improve the rest of the squad (say OL or something).
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by matthiasstephan on Mar 17, 2010 3:23 PM EDT reply actions
Any rumors?
About teams sniffing around any of our restricted free agents?
Yeah i dont know
The hire of Grossman really says nothing but a cheap fix for a short term problem. It also is a plus on two fronts.. I dont know it Grossman could out throw Colt. We need another backup and a Qb that has been to a Super Bowl (not that he got them there) could put Campbell more into focus. I dont think it really spells anyones demise. Little Shanny has worked with him already and knows his game. Thats all there is to it.
" IF YoU Are aRgUinG WiTh ME, YOU ArE WRonG!!!! "
just putting it out there...
i’ll be at fedex in the stands with a Barrett .50 if shanny even remotely ponders putting him in any game in the regular season….
Dorothy Mantooth is a saint!!!
Seems to me
and it appers to most of you, that this is the end of the Clausen/Bradford draft rumours. I know this imbecile writer read it the other way, but surely this signing says, “we are sticking with Campbell unless he stinks it up, then we have Grossman to plug in, and we draft a QB in 2011(Locker)”
I dont see how this signig possibly says that we are going to draft a QB this year.
Pommylee
On the other hand,
the first round tender put the Skins in a vulnerable position if another team accepted the tender conditions and added a condition that the Skins could not match. At least they now have a potential backup on board if another team sets conditions the Skins could not match for Campbell.
We won’t know the spin on this for a short while.
by Jefferson1935 on Mar 17, 2010 8:13 PM EDT up reply actions
Agree with you Pommylee,
as I’ve said before, the release of Collins dictated that we hire a veteran QB as a backup/competition to JC. ShanAllanhan seem to be doing this across the board—hiring people to make sure that the players we have on the roster right now know that they are fighting for their jobs. Good on that.
I don’t think that the hiring of LJ means the end of CP, or that the hiring of Grossman means the end of JC/Colt in the short run. It (hiring RG) ensures that we have competition in training camp for the starting QB job, which pushes JC to (hopefully) new heights.
We now have 4 QB’s on the roster. This does not mean that we won’t grab a rookie in the draft if the numbers come up that it’s the best choice we can make in any round (from 1st to 7th and beyond).
Shanahan has repeatedly stated in the media this week that ‘we are just looking to improve this year, and that this takes an evaluation of every position on the team, and that [competition] is what we are looking at’.
If we draft a QB, then we will have 5 on the roster, and two will be cut before the final deadline.
The important thing to remember is, that all spots are open right now, and that ShanAllanhan are creating a spirit of ‘survival of the fittest’ in Redskin’s Park.
This applies to the DE/OLB positions (Carter and soon to come in Porter) as well as the QB and RB positions.
We don’t have to keep any of them, just see who is ready and able and willing to produce in whatever scheme Shanny comes up with, and cut the rest, perhaps after training camp or in the preseason.
What is going on now, IMHO, is the gathering of as much talent as we can muster, and to see who really wants to play ball.
After all of that, I’d really like to post a question to the HH comraderie…………
Why do you think RG was only signed to a year?? And that will stir up all kinds of responses. But, seriously, I think the understanding of the answer to this question will give a great insight into ShanAllanhan’s thinking as to the QB question for our team for the near future. Are they thinking that they only need a veteran backup QB for one year? Who would be the backup next year? Do they think that, if RG does well this year, that we can sign him up as starting or backup for the next 3-5?
It boggles the mind, though I am all for signing veterans for very short-term contracts. (Get ‘em for now, and when we’ve made our progress through FA or the draft, we aren’t attached to them for, like 5 tenured years).
If he’s gone in a year, does that mean that ShanAllanhan believe that JC or Colt, or the drafted rookie would all be in place for a starting line-up as QB’s for this team?
Just asking,and wondering.
I read it exactly the same way, PommyLee
Half way through I was shaking my head and wondering where the logic and evidence to support JC being gone was going to shine through. It never came out.
Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana.
Seems to me
Pommy – it might mean that, but it could also be preparatory to trading JC (for picks) and drafting Bradford or Clausen. They naturally would not want to trade JC until they were sure they could get the guy they want (and if it’s only Bradford, they can’t be sure). In this scenario, Grossman really replaces JC as a stopgap QB until the rookie is ready. It would implicitly rate Grossman as somewhat comparable with JC, but with JC having a lot more trade value. Also however, the signing might mean nothing – simply replaces Todd with Rex, fully consistent with still gunning for a QB in the draft. In any case, I don’t think the Grossman signing puts an end to the Bradford/Clausen plans.
One can only hope....:)
I don’t think the Grossman signing puts an end to the Bradford/Clausen plans
Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana.
I don't see your first scenario panning out.
Even if we, say, get a QB in the draft, ShanAllanhan are not going to cut JC, unless they go out and get another veteran QB to compete with RG. In other words, if we let go of JC, we are still left with only one veteran on the roster. I don’t think the FO will start an NFL season in this manner. Allan is too competent to either start a rookie, or go into the season with Colt and the rookie as the only backups.
My bet is that JC and RG battle for 1 and 2, and we keep the most productive young guy to learn the system.
By the by, I just realized that JC and RG have only one year contracts. I guess we can always resign at the end of the year, depending upon what happens in 2010.
it means
that there are now 3 QB’s under contract, including one that has a year in the offensive system that K. Shanahan used last year. Reading anything else into it is like interpreting the meaning of a smile that a beautiful woman gives when she sees you.
I used to be disgusted, now I try to be amused....
Right before you put the $ in her G-string.
Yeah, I know exactly what you mean.
Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana.
I occasionally offer a little insight with my posts
to offset the ranting. Howsabout: Draft no QBs before their time. Their time being next year.
Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana.
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