Redskins' Andre Carter Talks About Possibly Being the Odd Man Out
by Kevin Ewoldt on Mar 12, 2010 10:42 AM EST
in Redskins Analysis
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PrintUpdate: Via Jason Reid at Redskins Insider - Andre is not unhappy
Jason Reid: "I know Carter very well...He is not unhappy and should not be lumped in with anyone who has publicly expressed dissatisfaction with the team for any reason.
Carter has a no-trade clause for the length of his contract. As of this week, the Redskins had not approached Carter about waiving it in an attempt to facilitate a trade, people familiar with the situation said. But Carter also is due a $3.2 million option bonus in July, and another of $4.075 million before the 2011 season."
Both Brian Murphy, of Homer McFanboy, and Chris Russell, of 106.7 THE FAN, were able to talk to to Andre Carter recently about what appears being the odd man out in the Redskins new, 3-4 defensive scheme. I'll first talk about Brian's interview, which is a must read in it's entirety. I've had a gut feeling Andre will be traded for a couple weeks now and these two interviews seem to defend that. Andre admits he was lost in the San Fran in 3-4, and it's not what he prefers to do. And why should he? Rushing as DE is what he does best, which he proved last year. From his talks with Jim Haslett, though, it appears there may be room for Andre:
"[Haslett] said I'll be the left outside linebacker and Brian Orakpo will be on the right," he said. "I'm used to being on the other side, but hey, he's the boss. Because I'm so used to being on the other side, I'll have to work on some things, like transferring certain muscle groups and things like that. But that's part of the job. There were times last year, with some of our packages, when I would line up on the left side, so I'm familiar with it. If that's what they want, then fine. As far as dropping back in coverage and things of that nature, the way he explained it to me, it's a lot easier than my experiences as a linebacker in 2005."
"Now, I've talked with Coach [Jim] Haslett and I understand that this 3-4 scheme is nothing like that Baltimore Ravens scheme and what I experienced in 2005," he continued. "For me, the most difficult part of that experience was coverage. Back then I had to cover the tight end man to man, and that was an experience."
So wait. Andre already has problems with a 3-4 coverage, so then you're going to move him to the other side where he'd have more problems?
Translation: "If we're unable to deal you...we're going to put you here."
Orakpo certainly had his problems in coverage too, but where Andre falls apart is his speed. In 2009, any RB that got the corner Andre was unable to close. That certainly could be said for most DE's, but this will be especially problematic if he's the OLB. Andre also honestly, and respectfully, explained his other flaws in gap coverage.
Homer McFanboy then gets into the details of his off-season. Does this sound like a player that will be a Redskin in 2010?...
Brian: Okay, so where are you and how are you?
"I'm back in California," Carter said. "I was in Virginia for a hot second because my wife and I bought a home in SoCal, so we were there to pack some stuff up. Now we're out here trying to get situated, so we're staying pretty busy."
Brian: So basically, you're saying you want out of D.C. and you no longer want to be a member of the Washington Redskins ...
(Laughs.) "Nah, nah, nah, man. I'm still a Redskin," he said. "Well, I think so."
The next big question is when did Andre buy his house in SoCal and put his up for sale? Since I'm a betting man, my guess is in the last 3 months.
Chris Russell paints a much bleaker picture from his interview with #99:
I can say that Andre Carter is mentally struggling with every aspect of the switch from defensive end to outside linebacker.
When I reached out via text on Thursday night to Carter, I asked if he wanted me to say anything on his behalf to dispute the La Canfora report or had he reached a point in his mind where he wanted to leave Washington. As part of his response, he simply said "As for the trade, no comment."
Carter added exclusively to 106.7 the FAN, "Right now, I'm still under contract with the Redskins and plan to attend minicamp (OTA's),"
Both statements quite honestly surprised me to a large degree, because I sensed a lot of frustration, hurt and perhaps even anger in Carter's words.
Image via www.femmefan.com
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I kinda disagree
I thought Andre was decent at covering ground.
In 2009, any RB that got the corner Andre was unable to close.
Anyway…
Carter doesn’t like the 3-4, isn’t comfortable in the 3-4 and has stated such publicly. While I think coaches should tailor to their players with game plans, if Haslett wants a 3-4 defense, then ditching Andre Carter isn’t going to be the most significant decision ever.
Carter is good not great.
"By far the worst performers on the team are in the front office." – Sally Jenkins
Carter was solid
and didn’t make many mistakes. The type of player this team is very low on at the moment.
Carter can’t do 3-4, he’s said it and it’s been stated by others, agreed. But losing a good player because they want to implement some new scheme doesn’t sound like fitting the scheme to the players to me. Part of my problem with the Haslett signing.
SpottieOttieDopaliscious
It's definitely not fitting the scheme to the players.
But I view this on two levels. One is the over all system (WCO, power running, 4-3, 3-4) whatever, the other is how you actually implement the system and make it a hybrid with other systems.
If Shanny & Haslett are convinced they want a 3-4 defense, they shouldn’t NOT do so because they don’t want to misuse Andre Carter. He’s simply not that unique of a talent.
Where the adaptability comes in is within the 3-4. The week to week game plan and play-calling has to suit your players.
"By far the worst performers on the team are in the front office." – Sally Jenkins
agree with smuts
Not a real big fan of the switch but if Carter is the only casualty of it then they are doing well. I just hope Orakpo can make the switch.
by BayAreaBullet on Mar 12, 2010 12:05 PM EST up reply actions
the assumption being made
is that players that can’t do it will be traded. Which isn’t what I’m saying.
If this happens, and ‘Rak simply can’t cut it in coverage, do you REALLY think they would trade him? FedEx Field would be burned to the ground in a matter of hours.
So what you end up having is a damn good athlete, that doesn’t have a place in a defense that he wasn’t drafted to be in. What do you do with him? Others that can’t make the switch?
SpottieOttieDopaliscious
I agree if it is just a player or two. but we need to replace several players on defense and acquire other skill sets outright. and we still need a free safety. our starting nose tackle right now did not play last year. our 100mm ace does not want to be a nose tackle at all. and the defense was pretty good to start. this is clearly just taking a system and ramming it down peoples throats. and who is doing it? jim haslett who has never won as a defensive coordinator or head coach. it is stupid. we need a lot of offensive players and this is costly and a distraction- esp if it uses up a draft pick. generally, i like the more cautious approach. but the benefit of the doubt is coming from my living room. snyder is nutz if he thinks i will pay why this team retools to suit a coaches preference. coaches coach- and add players to complement what they want to do over time.
by les boulez bomber on Mar 12, 2010 3:11 PM EST up reply actions
Carters ability in coverage is terrible
and now he’s stating it outright. What else does he need to do make the brass understand that it’s not going to go well. Haslett and Shanahan, your being warned NOW!
As far as Orakpo is concerned I have to believe that it will not be a better situation that Carters is. Orakpo has voiced his displeasure for being put at OLB and he never played their in college. Frankly, if you watch him on tape he is a force at DE with the 4 lineman.
I’ve said this before and I’ll say it again. This year will be basically an experiment on defense. Their is no possible way to get to the 3-4 without drafting some linebackers that played it in college or without siging some FA’s that are experienced at it. With the need of O-line, Shanny wanting a good QB to groom and now LB’s which we will need to draft a few of them, not just 1 or 2, the defense will be a 3 year project. Anotherwards in 3 years from now the defense should look like Haslett wants it to. Don’t forget in the next three years we will have other needs to fill not just those mentioned. The question is will Haslett be around in 3 or 4 years to see this project through or will we then sign someone with a different defensive philosophy. They have a great start at the defense now and they should stay with it IMO, but I have to say this has the chance of not going well with more years lost to personal ideology.
Elmis Dumervil is a lot like Orakpo
Was a DE moved to LB…and then he BLEW up…tallying loads of sacks.
"I am excited about starting 2009. We are looking forward to an outstanding year. We're on our way. We have a lot of healthy players this year." - Vinny Cerrato
by Kevin Ewoldt on Mar 12, 2010 11:12 AM EST up reply actions
I agree
But Orakpo and Carter are definitely resistant to it. Of course they’ll do it for the team if they have to, that doesn’t mean they’ll do it well. By the time this thing gets turned around Carter definitely won’t be on the team meaning another draft spot to fill his spot. I’m not saying it can’t work, I just don’t think it will be in the next 2 years.
For everyone wanting to see more turnovers out of the 3-4, I wouldn’t be holding your breathe either. Personnel has way more to do with it than just switching to a different scheme.
I don't think Dumervil is a good comparison
Dumervil struggled as a DE. Orakpo got the majority of his sacks last year with his hand down. Not sure Dumervil and Rak are the same kind of athletes.
by BayAreaBullet on Mar 12, 2010 12:08 PM EST up reply actions
Are you sure Orakpo had more sacks with hand down?
That Oakland game he had 2 sacks as LB.
"I am excited about starting 2009. We are looking forward to an outstanding year. We're on our way. We have a lot of healthy players this year." - Vinny Cerrato
by Kevin Ewoldt on Mar 12, 2010 3:03 PM EST up reply actions
Well outside of the Oakland game Rak had 7 sacks
I haven’t been able to find which slot he was in for those 7 sacks(I have been looking for weeks) but 5 out of the 7 came on third down, which is when he was usually at DE. As for Dumervil he was an undersized guy who was forced into a situational role due to his size. Orakpo doesn’t suffer from that problem. I was interested to see Dumervil’s combine results but apparently he didn’t do anything but the 40 and BP. I compared Orakpo’s combine results to Clay Matthews and Demarcus Ware like a week ago and while they are similar in 40 time and weight both of those guys were faster in lateral drills while Orakpo was significantly stronger. If we took away all his sacks as a DE I don’t think Orakpo would look very good as a OLB though obviously he would have an easier time as a 3-4 OLB than the 4-3 OLB he played part time. I think Greg Ellis would be a better comparison off the top of my head.
by BayAreaBullet on Mar 12, 2010 4:29 PM EST up reply actions
Also did you know Dumervil's middle name is "Kool"?
How can we get him on our team.
by BayAreaBullet on Mar 12, 2010 5:46 PM EST up reply actions
who cares. orakpo had a lot of sacks and went to the pro bowl as a DE. people do not do something they do not want to do as well as they do something they want to do. psych 101!
by les boulez bomber on Mar 12, 2010 3:14 PM EST up reply actions
Totally disagree about Rak
We’re gonna see a much more aggressive defense and it is gonna flow thru him, he’ll out perform his sacks this year.
if this were all about sacks
then Carter wouldn’t be saying any of this. There’s a coverage element to this as well.
SpottieOttieDopaliscious
Their is a big time coverage element to this
Call me nuts but from what I saw this past year Orakpo was terrible in coverage when he was at LB and from what I remember he wasn’t thrilled with being put their. Carter seems to be in an even worse boat because he’s telling them outright that he doesn’t like it because he’s not good at it. This is a situation that has a chance to go completely south during the season with no real fix mid season.
I don't think it takes 3-4 years to implement a 3-4 defense, or any system really.
In today’s NFL, things happen fast.
Within 2 seasons you could completely remake a defense.
"By far the worst performers on the team are in the front office." – Sally Jenkins
When you have multiple needs as the Redskins do
the choice is only about which areas to put off until the next draft.
errr…2013 when they have it figured out. why am i suppose to pay for an unfinished product when the only reason to go to a redskin game was the defense
by les boulez bomber on Mar 12, 2010 3:16 PM EST up reply actions
We can see where this is going.
Every rumor we are hearing is coming to fruition. I also wasn’t pleased with the Haslett hiring, but understand that Shanahan wanted to implement the 3-4 defense so Haslett was the guy. I am ok with the 3-4 and realize it is for the long term benefit of the team. Unfortunately there will be a growing curve that will take time to attain. So now we can add OLB to our ever-growing need of players to obtain this year. Fortunately the OLB position is easier to fill in the later rounds and undrafted since they are the smaller, faster players that can’t play defensive line at this level. At this point it is safe to say that they will completely re-do the defense save Orakpo, Haynesworth, Hall, and Horton/Landry. We are in complete re-build mode.
I think he meant every rumor about converting to the 3-4
"By far the worst performers on the team are in the front office." – Sally Jenkins
I sensed a lot of frustration in that text message....
Both statements quite honestly surprised me to a large degree, because I sensed a lot of frustration, hurt and perhaps even anger in Carter’s words.
Mind Readers
Whenever someone starts reading emotions (much less thoughts) in other people I jump off the wagon. The words can just as easily be understood as a person who isn’t thrilled about a situation but knows that it’s the situation he’s in and intends to make the best of it. Hence the “I’ve talked with Haslett and his 3-4 is nothing like the [Raven’s] 3-4” comment.
Pet peeve aside: I HATE it when sports announcers try to tell the audience what is going through the mind of a player. Unless they can read minds, THEY DON’T KNOW. Drives me nuts lol
Perfect example
I didn’t get the feeling that you were laughing at all during that post, and then at the end there you are. LOL
He's been shown the door
Andre plays and works harder than just about anyone on the team, it’s a shame to see the inevitable axe coming down from the 3-4 on him. He’s too old to revert back to an LB even in a 3-4 and although he’s got great outside speed for a DE it won’t cut it at LB.
Going on 31 and moving to SoCal atleast I don’t have to worry about seeing him elsewhere in the NFC east.
Hopefully he teaches JC some film watching methods before he leaves.
Andre Carter versus Orakpo
I was trying to watch some other DE play last season. Jared Allen’s play was of particular interest since he seemed to be able to play the run as well as be aggressive in the pass rush.
The offense tends to offset the aggressive pass rush by running inside the pass rush. On the other hand a dip by the opponents running back can cause the DE to over commit to the inside.
Carter was probably switched to the LDE when RAK played RDE because of his overall experience in the NFL. It did not work out that bad in the 4-3 defense. The pressure on the weak side linebacker likely increased to take on more outside run responsibility. The SS also ended up playing more like LB, i.e., Doughty high level of tackles. The compensation had it’s effects on pass coverage in the flats as well.
Now the issue in the 3-4 is whether either Carter or Rak can take their pass coverage to a higher level. Yet the 3-4s advantage is supposed to be in disrupting the offense with unexpected rushing from different positions from play to play. If a person gets some kind of mental block about something it also limits their ability to adapt. Carter seems to have his mind made up from his 49er experience. I don’t know that the same could be said about Rak.
Orakpo won't be in coverage very often.
He’ll play the DE/LB role (a rush backer, sometimes call a jack linebacker) in our 3-4/46 hybrid.
Think Terrell Suggs in Baltimore.
some of you know the ins and outs of these defenses better than i do. so please comment, but it seems to me that:
1- we always needed to pick up a linebacker that can cover TE better. I think both defenses will require a second linebacker/DE to cover the RB coming out of the backfield on occassion. I dont think there is any getting out of some coverage responsibiity whether we switch D or not
2- but now we are going 3-4, most of our DT are too small to convert. so we need to add a 3-4 capable DT and backup and at least one more DE
3- all in addition to our free safety needs
so the bottom line of switching to the 3-4 is that we need at least 3 more defensive linemen, two of which need to be at least starter quality. and some of our players we believe can make the switch but we dont really know yet.
is that accurate?
by les boulez bomber on Mar 12, 2010 4:00 PM EST reply actions
A few things that IMO will work
Lorenzo alexander seems to be a great fit for one of the LB spots. He’s very versatile and as well know can play all over the field. He has good size and athletisicm to both rush the passer and cover a back or TE.
I’m hoping they decide to use Haynesworth at DE as much as possible, this will maximize his potential and just as he helped the DE’s in the 4-3 he will do the same in the 4-3 at othe rpositions.
He (Fat AL) will definitely free up whoever is playing OLB on his side.
You’ll still need to double team AH where ever he lines up. Could be good.
Here are a few excerpts that may be of interest.
“In searching for something else I came across the plans for the new Redskins defense. Mike Shanahan says it will be a 3-4 that looks like a 4-3 because there will often be four men on the line of scrimmage. Basically, it is a 3-4 but instead of both OLB being edge rushers, one of them will play back like a “regular” OLB does in a 4-3.
(Note: that the lineup below was before Kimo was signed. Of interest was the 34E designation which is the 3-4 defensive end. Since this post the use of Alexander and Jarmon as OLB has been mentioned.)
DE Jeremy Jarmon (or Andre Carter)
NT Albert Haynesworth
34E Phillip Daniels
ELB Brian Orakpo
OLB Rocky McIntosh
ILB London Fletcher
ILB H.B. Blades
No, Carter won’t be a 3-4 end. The other side has a pass-rushing DE (hence my designations of “DE” and “34E”). That side doesn’t have an OLB up on the line.
Since my last post the Redskins signed former Panther DT Ma’ake Kemoeatu. According to one of my main sources (either profootballweekly.com or ffmastermind.com, I forgot which one), Keomeatu will play NT and the even more huge Albert Haynesworth will play the pass-rushing DE, believe it or not. He sometimes did this in Nashville and was successful. Haynesworth will mainly be assigned the C-gap between the ROT and TE. This means Carter will either backup Albert or Brian Orakpo at edge linebacker (or be traded).
The Redskins sometimes played this defense last season. extremeskins.com has a forum with photos of it. You might have to google “extremeskins.com” with “forum” or “3-4 defense” or something if you can’t find it on the home page."
by Jefferson1935 on Mar 12, 2010 10:24 PM EST up reply actions
Andre and the 3-4
I mentioned before – when the 3-4 was just a rumor – that we didn’t seem to have the players for a 3-4, so Shanahan would have to make a lot of changes, and misuse some players, and I went on to wonder if it was all worth it. I still wonder. Carter is just another example of a misfit in the 3-4. The shift is beginning to effect the whole rebuilding – they lost Foote but got Kemo. No criticism – I just hope they know what they’re doing!
check this
I see the Skins have also signed another tight end……Im seeing it as maybe the skins r setting up a trade with the Rams for their number 1 pick sending Carter and Cooley along with there third or 4th round pick. Giving us Bradford and Okung in the top 4 spots.Is this possible?
He's sticking by his contract
that includes a no-trade option. Andre stands to gain if the Redskins have to initiate trade talks, and tipping his hand or acting disgruntled would indicate he’s amenable to a trade. I figure both he and the Redskins are thinking trade, but he wants them to make the offer. Look forward to Andre being part of a larger trade or draft day deal. No way both he and Rak can play OLB at the same time….only room for one dedicated blitzing OLB in a 3-4 scheme.
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